screamin' demon

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:37 am

so i just did a bit of research and came up with something i want to try...

apparently i shouldn't have gapped my plugs that big, you're only supposed to gap your plugs to your application ... my engine isn't high output or set up for turbo, etc., etc. - so therefore i should have kept my plugs at their standard gap to get what i wanted out of the ignition coil - presently i am causing too high of compression and making too large of a gap for my spark to bridge especially when my car is cold - get it? ... that causes the misfire as it can't "reach" perse

so tomorrow morning i'll be picking up a new set of four NGK iridium plugs at standard .035 gap and trying that out - i will continue to update all of you on my trials and tribulations with this

i've had three separate people explain the exact same thing to me - they said it sounds like the ignition is working fine, it's the plugs ... gapped WAY too large for the application and output

these people were:

1.tech support from century performance (http://www.centuryperformance.com/spark.asp good info - i called them)

2.my best friend's father who chills with the mopar PVO rally guys in michigan and rallies alol year round, including iced over lake racing

3. and the guys at borchardt speed shop here in milwaukee

- Tony

satrnbmb · Post by **satrnbmb** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:46 pm

22stars wrote: i am causing too high of compression a

The rest of what you said makes sense. The larger the gap is, the more voltage is needed to jump the gap. I've never heard of wider gapped plugs "causing" higher compression. I always thought that was a function of volume differential at different parts of the cycle.

nodestiny · Post by **nodestiny** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:21 pm

Yeah, spark plugs shouldnt have anything to do with compression really. But yeah, too large of a gap and they will not fire correctly...

Any disadvantages to gapping them too small?

02SRT-4Swap · Post by **02SRT-4Swap** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:36 pm

not trying to start anything but how are your plug wires......

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:56 pm

alright:

satrnbmb: yeah, i questioned that myself, but i just put on here what i was told ... since the rest of it made sense (and i'm still sort of a n00b) i figured it was worth a shot ... which we'll know about tomorrow

nodestiny: no idea, and don't think i'm gonna try it - i'm putting them back to stock spec .035 and hoping that corrects the misfire at least since they are .065 as recommended on the box, however there is someone on here that i read in a thread said he left the gap at .035 and no problems - i can tell the difference with the screamin demon, it's this damn misfire that's overshadowing it right now

02srt-4swap: no no no man, didn't figure you were starting anything - definitely a valid question ... but i have the Magnecor KV85 Competition (8.5mm) wires and i put those in in April and look fine to me

- Tony

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:33 pm

for starters, you cant gap the NGK iridiums normally with the standard gap tool. You will break the electrode off.
As for the gap is concerned, it depends on your compression and if you are forced inducted. If we are talking about a standard Magnum motor or a Non proper gapping based on your ignition helps.
From my past experience, if it calls for a .035 gap, and you set it to .045 youwill actually have more top end rev and power. The smaller the gap, the lower the revs.
I tested this years ago on a vehicle with no rev limiter. Lets say it called for a .032 gap...it revved till about 5500rpm and then started to break up. With the same setup, I gapped it to .045 and it hit 6500rpm then started to break up.
The OEM gap use as your baseline for N/A motors. The better your ignition, open it up a lil more. Im not saying go from .032 to .065. Just do some trial and error.
FYI - Ive got a cheap generic tool that measures 10,000volts upto 50,000volts. I also used this for testing....

As for forced induction, I ran a car with 25psi of boost and blew out the spark with a .035 gap using a Mallory Hi-Fire ignition setup. I ended up sacrifising some top end rev because I had to run a .028 gap...
If you dont understand what im talking about, I either did not explain it simple enough, or you should not be gapping your plugs

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:37 pm

blackroseracing: nope - i got ya loud and clear ... so with that i may go to .040 - first though i'm trying standard .035 to see if it rids me of my damned misfire - if it doesn't i obviously have other problems, you know?

a little more top end would be nice, and thank you for yet agin shedding some light on a situation for me

- Tony

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 8:00 pm

people don't belive me but I try....
my proof of past experience is in CALI for data recovery....so far no luck

turboN2O · Post by **turboN2O** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 2:33 am

nodestiny wrote:Put your stocker on, and exchange it for a new one. Thats what i would personaly do. If the new one does the same thing... return it and get your money back. Sorry to hear about all this trouble, but it happens!

I'll second this. But then again nobody liked my opinion in the first place.. Joke......

Richard Z.

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 7:04 am

I just opened my iridiums up last night to .050 w/ stock ignition coil and mopar performance wires... the car is even more responsive now! It pulled even harder in the top end too.

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 9:54 am

*UPDATE*

...so all i have to say after i put the proper plugs in (gapped to .035 NGK iridiums) is:

damn

that was the issue causing the misfire ... and now the idle is smooth, more aggressive, and just as i wanted ... more pull, more response, and well worth the money - i only wish i had realized my issue with the plug gap before then, other than that this is a sound investment

and blackroseracing: that is awesome - i'm gonna give her a little more time with these plugs at .035, and then the ones i took out i'm going to take back down to about .040 - .045 and see what i get - again thank you for the info and for the advice, i hope one day i get to meet you and a few others from here at 2gn.org

ever make it to the midwest?

- Tony

satrnbmb · Post by **satrnbmb** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 10:41 am

Can you check to see how your performance MPGwise is affected with this?

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Thu Oct 20, 2005 10:47 am

just filled up this morning and before i was getting between 28 and 30 MPG

i reset the trip-meter and i'll let y'all know how that goes in the next couple of days

- Tony

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Fri Oct 21, 2005 6:38 pm

the way I normally drive....

93 octane (sunoco) averaged 28mpg and pulled nice....

93 octane (Mobil) in tank now, doing rally sunday, let you know asap

91 octane -- to be tested

89 octane (Mobil) 23mpg, lost top end pull, lots of bottom end, mid was

topped @ 120mph in 4th at 6500rpm, when I grapped fifth the car pretty much stayed at 122mph and would not pull anymore....

Im running a .050 gap now this week on my iridiums, we will see what happens next...

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Fri Oct 21, 2005 6:42 pm

please keep me informed

dblsg · Post by **dblsg** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 4:11 am

not to make his head any bigger, but BRR is the man....... one of my heros

he hits on hot chicks (scneonchick) all the time and never gets shut down

oops, i'm sorry, did i say her name out loud? you guys know i'm just messing with yall...., but serius, him and diablo, and a few other are full of good info. Just wanna say thanks guys.

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 8:29 am

^^^
I try the best I can, ive got 10years worth of knowledge on modding that I want to pass down. And since I joined this forum I'm learning more and more daily. Diablo, and others have really helped me knowledge wise.
As for Chic, we are just playin around...got to have some fun somewhere

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 9:42 am

i agree with you dblsg, thanks for all the help guys

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:00 am

anytime,
and no my head is not getting bigger with envy.....its getting bigger with knowledge

I have to have a drink to mellow out lately because of info overload

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:17 am

HA! - wait, it's too early to drink

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:21 am

I'm on my 3rd steel reserve right now, and I fell normall for a change....

No pain from my back, no coughing from Bronchitus, and no worries about my problems. Im not drunk yet, im just mellow...

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:23 am

alright then, i can agree with that

not like i haven't done it

sucks aboot the bronchitis though - i know it's a bitch, are you a smoker too? and what happened to your back?

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:25 am

come on over to the shout box.....we can shoot the shit...

22stars · Post by **22stars** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:29 am

down

i be there

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 12:25 pm

anyways, back on topic.....
any questions, just ask...