Engine Starts But Wont Run!

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Put-Put_Neon
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Engine Starts But Wont Run!

Post by Put-Put_Neon » Sat Feb 21, 2015 1:37 pm

Hello, recently when we experienced a cold snap here my car would not run. It starts up, runs fine for 1-3 seconds and shuts off. I've tried giving it gas and it still shuts off. The Coolant Temperature Sensor light begins to flash when it does this. There is coolant in the reservoir and radiator, but the coolant was low before the cold snap(since topped off). I also have a new battery in the car.

My CTS does not seem as accessible as some other people who have made videos on youtube.

Image

The bolt is hidden behind a bracket that is attached to the engine block.

Image

These two hoses are extra thick and physically attached to this bracket. Removing the bracket is also extremely difficult.

Image

What I assume to be evidence of an oil leak.

Image[/img]

ducktapetg
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Location: New Hampshire

Post by ducktapetg » Sat Feb 21, 2015 4:16 pm

My first thought is a sticking IAC however I am not sure if that would make the coolant light flash. Looking at the link below may help you diagnose it better though or at least give you something to read before someone else chimes in.

viewtopic.php?t=67323&sid=9639a0610fa3d ... 629881bc83
Jason

2001 r/t
1998 r/t Project Log --> viewtopic.php?t=66496

NickKo
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Post by NickKo » Sat Feb 21, 2015 6:49 pm

It could be your Coolant Temperature Sensor going bad, that is causing this issue. In fact, the 'symptoms' you describe, sound like a CTS problem.

If the PCM cannot get a reading from the CTS, it will 'assume' the engine is at full warm-up, and hot enough to kick the cooling fans 'on'.
This will affect fuel trims as well, which is why the engine won't run... Because it will run the engine too lean for a cold-start.
If this is the case, you should notice that the Radiator Fans are kicking on immediately.... Even when the engine is still 'cold'.

Consider changing the CTS, or inspecting the wiring to the CTS.


- Nick
-1998 2-dr SOHC MTX= 57mm TB; Maddog STS
-2000 Ply.LX w/MTX = Maddog STS; CAI; 2.5 exh.; 60mm T/B
-2001 ATX w/Syked PCM + Magnum header
-2001 ACR w/SRT T/B bored out to 55mm

Official "I'm Going to Drive My Neon till it Dies" Club #000009

Put-Put_Neon
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Post by Put-Put_Neon » Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:11 pm

NickKo wrote:It could be your Coolant Temperature Sensor going bad, that is causing this issue. In fact, the 'symptoms' you describe, sound like a CTS problem.

If the PCM cannot get a reading from the CTS, it will 'assume' the engine is at full warm-up, and hot enough to kick the cooling fans 'on'.
This will affect fuel trims as well, which is why the engine won't run... Because it will run the engine too lean for a cold-start.
If this is the case, you should notice that the Radiator Fans are kicking on immediately.... Even when the engine is still 'cold'.

Consider changing the CTS, or inspecting the wiring to the CTS.


- Nick
Thanks for this! Hopefully changing this fixes t.

Ah, changing the CTS! It's been so difficult, after finally figuring out how to unscrew the cam position sensor(heater cables in the way), i broke all of the hard plastic insulator off the wires to the cam sensor. It was extremely brittle, is it ok to leave the wires "free" like that?

NickKo
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Post by NickKo » Sun Feb 22, 2015 3:48 pm

Put-Put_Neon wrote: Ah, changing the CTS! It's been so difficult, after finally figuring out how to unscrew the cam position sensor(heater cables in the way), i broke all of the hard plastic insulator off the wires to the cam sensor. It was extremely brittle, is it ok to leave the wires "free" like that?
Assuming the car runs like that, I would say it's OK..... *BUT* only *Temporary*. :quotes:
At some point, I would replace the connector, with one from a junkyard -- Otherwise, the wiring could come loose... Usually at an inconvenient time.

You don't even have to splice in new wires.... Just replace the plastic connector itself.
It is actually pretty easy, to remove the spade terminals from the connector -- Once you figure out the 'trick'.
You'll need a very thin probe, to depress the 'tangs' or retainer 'tabs' that hold the wire spade in place.... Then you can slide the wire out of the connector.
You may want to practice this on a connector from the junkyard, first -- It may make more sense that way.

There is an excellent write-up on Neons.Org, posted by 'Alpinegreenneon', with some nice pictures, explaining all of this.
http://forums.neons.org/viewtopic.php?f=125&t=295960


- Nick
-1998 2-dr SOHC MTX= 57mm TB; Maddog STS
-2000 Ply.LX w/MTX = Maddog STS; CAI; 2.5 exh.; 60mm T/B
-2001 ATX w/Syked PCM + Magnum header
-2001 ACR w/SRT T/B bored out to 55mm

Official "I'm Going to Drive My Neon till it Dies" Club #000009

Put-Put_Neon
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Post by Put-Put_Neon » Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:44 pm

NickKo wrote:
Put-Put_Neon wrote: Ah, changing the CTS! It's been so difficult, after finally figuring out how to unscrew the cam position sensor(heater cables in the way), i broke all of the hard plastic insulator off the wires to the cam sensor. It was extremely brittle, is it ok to leave the wires "free" like that?
Assuming the car runs like that, I would say it's OK..... *BUT* only *Temporary*. :quotes:
At some point, I would replace the connector, with one from a junkyard -- Otherwise, the wiring could come loose... Usually at an inconvenient time.

You don't even have to splice in new wires.... Just replace the plastic connector itself.
It is actually pretty easy, to remove the spade terminals from the connector -- Once you figure out the 'trick'.
You'll need a very thin probe, to depress the 'tangs' or retainer 'tabs' that hold the wire spade in place.... Then you can slide the wire out of the connector.
You may want to practice this on a connector from the junkyard, first -- It may make more sense that way.

There is an excellent write-up on Neons.Org, posted by 'Alpinegreenneon', with some nice pictures, explaining all of this.
http://forums.neons.org/viewtopic.php?f=125&t=295960


- Nick
maybe I used the wrong word, the hard plastic conduit that was around the wires broke. The insulation is intact but there is no electrical tape or conduit around the wires.

Anyway, turns out the car wasnt recognizing the key. So i replaced the coolant sensor for nothing, but at least that allowed me to spot an oil leak at the cam sensor that i fixed.

Well...the dealer is raping me, $216 for one key. Smh.

sidepipe87
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Post by sidepipe87 » Tue Feb 24, 2015 3:13 pm

Put-Put_Neon wrote: Well...the dealer is raping me, $216 for one key. Smh.
Maybe I missed something... why do you need a key? Did you lose or break your SKIM key? The car certainly won't start without it
PM me for your 03+ PCM SKIM/VIN flashing needs.

Put-Put_Neon
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Post by Put-Put_Neon » Wed Feb 25, 2015 12:06 am

sidepipe87 wrote:
Put-Put_Neon wrote: Well...the dealer is raping me, $216 for one key. Smh.
Maybe I missed something... why do you need a key? Did you lose or break your SKIM key? The car certainly won't start without it
The grey coating broke off so it was just the black plastic with the chip inside. Maybe it fell in the snow or something idk, but all of a sudden it just failed. It was working one minute, 2 hours later it wasnt and at least i was at home.

occasional demons
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Post by occasional demons » Wed Feb 25, 2015 9:42 am

Dang it, it didn't make sense at the time when you said the coolant temp sensor light was flashing. I was tired and ready for bed when I read it. That is not a coolant temp light, it is the SKIM light. The round red light correct?

There is no warning for over heating, except the CEL...

That should have clicked, but my car doesn't have the SKIM feature, so it wasn't something I automatically think about.

But at least you got something out of it, just sucks the dealer was your only option. IIRC, some Wal Marts can program the key, it is $70 for the key, and you have to hope they can cut it correctly, tho that would be out of their pocket.

Too bad you don't have a spare, you could program a third ebay key as a back up.
Bill
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epic

2001 Neon ES MTX with '02 R/T PCM
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