Srt Brakes? knuckle issues

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:34 pm

Hey gents

I was trying to figure out what needs to be done to convert to SRT-4 brakes on my neon. I searched the sites and some people say you either need the SRT rack or trim the factory neon inner tie rod ends. Well since I work for the company that makes the racks I dug into it father. The neon stuff I’m still searching for who has the info but I did find the PT info…. Here’s what I gathered. 13 different rack assemblies …Yes I know….. Right and left hand drive…. 6 different rack travel restrictors. As far as I can tell the racks are all the same dimensionally just the rack travel changes. It works this way…. If they need to install a large 17” tire rack it gets a blue rack restrictor maybe 25mm thick. If it get’s a 16” tire it would get a 15mm red thick restrictor because the car is capable of turning more. The question I have is what does the knuckle look like? Tie rods are the same for all 13 so that’s not it either. This doesn’t make much sense to me? Anybody have photos of both knuckles side by side?

Thanks

Post by **Diablo0** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:52 pm

You want SRT knuckle compared to Neon knuckle, correct? I can get a pic of that when I get home...

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:20 pm

Yep..... SRT vs neon would be great..... A photo of where the tie rod attaches would be the best....

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:44 pm

oldracecar wrote:I work for the company that makes the racks

Feedback for the designers there:

Use a better or wider bushing in the racks. They wear out way to easy.

First car I've had a rack bushing wear out on and by the sounds of it I'm not the only one.

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 4:41 pm

The mounting bushing wore out? Wow.... that's a new one for me.... At how many miles did that happen.... I'll did into that one too.....

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 6:13 pm

Yeah, the rack rattles around in the housing. Need to get to swapping it out. Probably had around 130 000km on it when I first noticed it.

I'm at 204 000 and change now

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:09 am

Hey the drawning that I'm showing is the driverside mount is securely fastened to the K-frame and the passengers side has a u bracket with a rubber isolater.... I'm not sure how it could wear?

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:27 pm

That's the housing to the k-member mounting. That's not the part that's wearing. The physical rack (the part that the tie rods fasten to and moves side to side) rattles around inside the rack housing. The bushing that goes between the toothed/geared rack and the rack housing wears out so that it rattles around no matter how secure the rack is to the k-member.

Post by **Diablo0** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:43 pm

oldracecar wrote:Yep..... SRT vs neon would be great..... A photo of where the tie rod attaches would be the best....

I'll snap you a picture tonight...

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:25 pm

Well let me see if I can I can understand better what's wearing out....

Starting from inner tie on the drivers side, you have a little plastic piece that limit rack travel that's the rack stop...

The next piece that comes into contact with the rack is the pinion...

Directly behind this is the yoke... This piece is a self adjusting slider that keeps tension on the pinion teeth so that they don't become dis-engaged... it is more or less a "c" with a spring behind it to keep tension on the rack

This leads us to the middle of the rack seal area which is a pivot point and a support. Fluid is transfer to one side to the other by valving and this is the center seal which floats and is attached to the rack.

At the other end is the rack bushing which is to help support the rack ... it is held in with a metal wire ring under the bellows clamp

then rack stop travel restrictor....

and the inner tie rod

Are you replacing this part that is wearing out or just replacing the rack?

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:52 pm

It's the rack bushings that support the rack in the housing. They wear out and the rack just rattles around. These racks need better bushings.

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:21 pm

The basic design of this rack has been used from the 80's cars.... I'll do some asking about it.... I've never had one rattle..... Sway bars.... Control arms but not the rack..... I'm still not sure how your wearing it out.... the bushing on one end is at least 1/4 thick in diameter...... The yoke wears but as long as the grease stays in the unit it should be fine..... As the suspension moves the tierods take a majority of the loads up and down

Let me look around and see if I can dig up some durablity gears to see if the issue exists in other platforms..... BTW as with every product there's some bean counter that figures cost versus durabilty.... If they can make it cheaper and Chrylser accepts it that's how it happens.... Not saying it's right or wrong just the way it works..... Sorry......

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:51 pm

Forget about it.

Post by **Diablo0** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:17 am

Neon.

SRT

Neon

SRT

Neon

SRT

oldracecar · Post by **oldracecar** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:24 am

Wow, other than the brake area they don't look different at all? I'm not sure why you would have to modify the inner tie rods at all? The distance appears to be the same? Thanks....

Post by **Diablo0** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:39 am

It's a little different... I can try to get some good measurements when I get home since I took those pictures around 10pm last night without taking any.

Post by **Diablo0** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:45 am

I did a little bit of measuring tonight and the tie rod point on the SRT knuckle is about 11/16ths closer to the center of the car than the Neon. Meaning, the SRT steering rack is at least 11/16th on each side shorter than the Neon rack. Reason for swapping is there is not enough thread on the Neon rack to allow for that 11/16th adjustment inwards of the outer tie rod. I had my rack from my R/T sitting next to me which was set on 0 toe. Measuring the thread left on the inner tie rod there was about 5/8" left of thread before you could not screw the tie rod on any farther to accommodate the 11/16" That being said, when you went to install the SRT knuckes without swapping the racks, you'll have a slight toe in when the outter tie rods are screwed in completely as far as they'd go.

Neon:

SRT:

2GN.ORG

Srt Brakes? knuckle issues

Srt Brakes? knuckle issues

Re: Srt Brakes? knuckle issues