2GN Rally Neon Build Project

Do you have a project going or will you be starting a project here very soon and just want to keep a log of everything you and when? Share with everyone every step of the way what sort of progress you are making on your project.
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webkris
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Post by webkris » Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:36 pm

INVUJerry wrote:If you put srt rear struts and use sxt springs there is a little lift involved. You could also get some ground control springs and coil sleeves, but that's money.
Oh - so the SRT perch is higher on both the front and rear.
That's good info.

Thanks Jerry!

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webkris
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The Prescott Rally 2011 – Some last minute drama…

Post by webkris » Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:51 pm

The Prescott Rally 2011 – Some last minute drama…

Last Tuesday after a marathon weekend of mounting seats, belts, lights, etc. I wanted to drive the 2GN rally car to work and get some miles on it before the rally. I start her up in the garage – *blub *blub *blub *blub “Why does that not sound right?” *blub *blub… Sounds like it’s running on three cylinders. I open the hood and the engine is bobbling around pretty good. Rev the motor, drive it around the block, no power, call it done, and park it back in the garage.

In the evening I pull the code P0202 from the computer. This means the “Fuel Injection Circuit has failed on cylinder 2.” Only three things to check and replace. I swap injector 1 and 2 and nothing changes. I test the wiring going to the PCM with a meter and it’s fine. The only thing left is a bad PCM / ECU (Power Control Module / Electronic Control Unit) and I have no idea why it failed. Right now I think it had hesitation issues when I bought it and they got worse. Plus the wiring loom in the front went into the AC compressor, remember?

Wednesday morning, worst nightmare happens – no one has a computer in stock. The last one in the US (you think I’m kidding…) is sent over-night to Tustin Dodge for Thursday. I formulate a backup plan and find one from a junkyard for an automatic (I confirm that it will throw a code, but still run). To add to the drama, you can’t just plug in an old ECU and expect it to work in a car from this century. The dashboard and key module are aware of the VIN number and won’t start without re-programming from a dealer. :mad:

On Thursday morning we are all packed on the tow dolly and ready to head to Arizona with a car that only runs on three cylinders. :| I drop the 2GN off at the dealership at 7am and go to work. I finally receive a phone call later in the day. The part is in, and the tech I know there (who is a past Neon Owners Club member) has installed the new PCM and was able to re-flash the junkyard one (sometimes it won’t go). The car is running great and we are good to leave for Prescott after work. Now the real adventure can begin. :D

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webkris
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The Prescott Rally 2011

Post by webkris » Tue Oct 04, 2011 4:08 pm

The Prescott Rally 2011

The Prescott Rally in Arizona is a fantastic event. The roads, the volunteers, the organizers, and the stage are awesome. This year the organizers gave us the opportunity to test out our new rally car on the stages by running zero car.

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How did it go? Great! The chassis feels solid and the steering modifications are amazing at speed. Tossing the car through the end of Witty Tom South (a stage with lots of 4′s and 3′s) had me turning the wheel no more then 90 degrees. A big plus for the quickener experiment. The rallycross suspension setup was decent, but not ready for cattle-guards at 70+ mph. We embarrassingly nosed in a couple of times, and after the third time hopping the rear end through a ditch, I slowed for the remainder of them. This 2.0l n/a motor feels stronger then the one in the Production car and it will be fun to rally on for a couple more events before swapping a turbo SRT4 power-plant in.

Some pictures of the event:
http://grandviewphoto.me/photocart/inde ... age=109674

As I feared, the stock engine mounts are completely unable to cope with this kind of abuse. The motor mount rubber on the passenger frame side ripped about halfway through stage 2. This added to the noise in the cabin and kept me from really putting down the throttle. It was a mistake not to address this before Prescott. Solid “dog bone” mounts are on order and I’m going to poly fill or weld (haven’t decided) the engine and trans mounts before the Glen Helen rallycross on October 16th.

We have a laundry list of things to fix and change, but overall it was a very successful test!

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UriahRR
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Post by UriahRR » Tue Oct 04, 2011 11:51 pm

Damn, I love seeing people who actually use their cars for what they're worth. Nice run man, the steering sounds awesome. Would love to take a ride with you and love to give you a ride, no homo, just swapping cars for a day.

Still loving the race car man :thumbup:
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webkris
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Post by webkris » Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:31 pm

Crap! All my picture links got jacked up!

Here's us at North Nevada with the new car last month:
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Here's the flickr rally car build gallery link for now - I'll go back and edit in a bit.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/planetkris ... 804283307/

- Kris

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Danteneon
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Post by Danteneon » Sat Aug 11, 2012 8:46 am

Wow, the last minute PCM problem would have drove me mental! Good thing you have some connections because that situation could have been a real nightmare.

I'm really glad to see this project coming along. We don't get to see rally builds like this :thumbup:
If I could just figure out how to meld the Outback and the Neon into one car...

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fattycrack
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Post by fattycrack » Mon Aug 13, 2012 7:14 pm

PLEASE HIRE ME ON YOUR TEAM!!!!!! but for real tho i really wanna get into racing and all that
5 speed blaze red 03 sxt, boosted.

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UriahRR
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Post by UriahRR » Mon Aug 13, 2012 11:48 pm

I actually crew for a team with a few local road race cars (Formula 5000, GT3, GT1), one of which we went to the 50th Rolex 24 at Daytona with this year. If that's anything like working on a Rally team and you're anywhere in the Northeast area, I'd be glad to help out on the side or under the table. :thumbup:
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webkris
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Post by webkris » Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:16 am

Okay - after about 30 min of back editing (Love my 2GN.org fans!) I got the pics all up and linked to the Flickr page!

I'm writing a post over the next couple of days, but we're going to talk about these bad boys:
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Serious business by webkris, on Flickr
THIS ^ is the suspension system I have on the new 2GN rally car. This is what makes rally possible!

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Rally car build continues: struts done, now for skidplate fab 4 NNR #rallycar #rally by webkris, on Flickr

Thanks guys! - Kris
- and oh BTW I'm having a little twitter contest for the fans: http://goo.gl/lgLP9
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fattycrack
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Post by fattycrack » Thu Aug 16, 2012 11:16 pm

damnnnnn i want that set up lol and im in southern wi. lol i really really want to get into racing and being on a team.
5 speed blaze red 03 sxt, boosted.

chew*
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Post by chew* » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:31 pm

That steering quickener is preety slick. Looks to be a reverse engineered version of a torque multiplier.

I'm assuming that it comes at a cost of more "effort" or pressure needed to turn wheel which was the reason for pump modification.

That means a manual rack is not really an option in this application.

Really slick work on the car and nice driving in that video. :thumbup:

Good call on rewelding Ebrake/shifter bracket to body. The factory welds are known to break, I welded mine as well.
If the parts car is cleaner rust wise than your car, swap the inner dash panels (VIN) and use the parts car with your title.
But don't street race..!!??

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webkris
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Post by webkris » Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:00 am

chew* wrote:That steering quickener is preety slick. Looks to be a reverse engineered version of a torque multiplier.

I'm assuming that it comes at a cost of more "effort" or pressure needed to turn wheel which was the reason for pump modification.

That means a manual rack is not really an option in this application.

Really slick work on the car and nice driving in that video. :thumbup:

Good call on rewelding Ebrake/shifter bracket to body. The factory welds are known to break, I welded mine as well.
Thanks!
Yep - 1 turn in = 1.5 turns out. There's a little planet + sun gear setup inside. You are correct a manual rack is no dice. The steering is a little heavier, but the pump modification is really because you can steer faster then the pump. Getting a pump-catch condition where there is no more fluid filling the rack.

Car is out for paint - here is a sneak peek!
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http://rallynotes.com/2012/09/out-for-paint-and-vinyl/

- Kris

FlexdXJ
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Post by FlexdXJ » Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:26 am

Just read this thread. Got a line on some winterforce tires for my neon. Looking to do some RallyX with it, just for fun. Its cool to see threads like this, Keep it up. I'll be following this one!
I still hate Neons...

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webkris
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Post by webkris » Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:48 pm


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webkris
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Post by webkris » Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:32 am

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Ready to rally!

adxavier06
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Post by adxavier06 » Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:23 am

Looking really good.
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D-Railed_Neon
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Post by D-Railed_Neon » Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:42 am

Just checked out your site and Flickr accounts. Seriously nice work guys!!!! This thing is an absolute beast! Thanks for reminding us of what these little skittles are capable of. Keep up the good work :thumbup:
MY PROJECT LOG My Old 2002 ES AND My 2003 SXT

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webkris
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Post by webkris » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:25 am

Thanks guys!

Here's some highlights from Prescott!
http://youtu.be/Qs33QNuBJDo?hd=1

- Kris

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webkris
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Post by webkris » Wed Oct 10, 2012 11:32 am

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webkris
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MegaSquirt and All Motor

Post by webkris » Tue Nov 05, 2013 2:42 pm

Hey guys - I hope you have been following over on rallynotes.com - http://rallynotes.com/tumblelog/ We've been very busy with our 2GN:

Prescott 1st Fri, 2nd Sat CRS2, 4th Overall, NASA Champions 2WD!
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Here's some video from our fast fast FAST finish on stage 1 of the Prescott Rally last month: http://youtu.be/vN5RkQqcPKE

A little change of plans to note: We are going to stick with the Group-2 class for the time being. There are only a handful of Open 2WD (turbo) cars running in the country, and it's no fun to win 1st of ONE. Group-2 or "CRS-2" as it's called in the California Rally Series is basically limited to 2,000cc's and ANYTHING else you can think of can be modified. So an all motor build has started with a MegaSquirt 3: viewtopic.php?p=993338

I'll periodically update here - but for the latest you can subscribe to rallynotes.com (we're on facebook and twitter too)

See you on the stages!
- Kris

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Post by ragek23 » Tue Nov 05, 2013 8:33 pm

Wow this is amazing! Congrats on your Prescott rally win.

Do you need to re-enforce the undercarriage with Kevlar? I saw the team-O'Neil fiesta R2 cars had Kevlar all over underneath and they were still getting stones through the floor pan.

2002 Neon SXT Sold
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smallblockfreak
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Post by smallblockfreak » Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:45 pm

When I sat inside Chris Greenhouse Srt I didn't notice any holes in the floor pan. I also didn't study the floor much because I was talking to him.
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webkris
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Post by webkris » Wed Nov 06, 2013 1:55 pm

ragek23 wrote:Wow this is amazing! Congrats on your Prescott rally win.

Do you need to re-enforce the undercarriage with Kevlar? I saw the team-O'Neil fiesta R2 cars had Kevlar all over underneath and they were still getting stones through the floor pan.
Thanks!

Kevlar underbody protection is the light and expensive option. :D We (and many others) use HDPE (High Density Poly-Ethylene) plastic sheets to protect the underside from rocks. The front of our car is protected with a 3/16" 6061 Aluminum skid plate.

Also - as we rally in the Sothwest - the rocks (small boulders) are nothing like you get in the Northwest or the Northeast. So our cars need to be tougher in areas of skidplate and underbody protection... I made a video a while back that you might be interested in: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zo3pitP7WEw

This picture tells that story - some BIG rocks in the Southwest:
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ragek23
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Post by ragek23 » Thu Nov 07, 2013 7:56 am

Wow thats a pretty good alternative to kevlar for sure. You probably get slightly better aerodynamics having a flat like bottom too. the R2 is more of a lets paste it to the bottom solution. Obviously its not that much of a weight issue since you are doing so well. Keep up the good work. Its awesome to see neons kicking butt.

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neonrog
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Post by neonrog » Wed Nov 13, 2013 1:29 am

Let me understand this better, PT or SRT struts with stock Neon springs will lift the nose of the car? Or do I need PT springs as well? I don't really want to rally my 03 SE, but I'm sick and tired of scraping the chin on everything. A little lift can't hurt (hey, I'm a Jeep guy). Also, I'd love more pictures of the lightbars. And did you do anything to reinforce/support the crashbar? Thanks, looks like you are having a whale of a time...
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occasional demons
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Post by occasional demons » Wed Nov 13, 2013 7:36 am

I would stick to SRT struts and regular neon springs. You will get into camber issues going to high, just like you would with a drop. A PT sway bar might not be a bad thing if you do raise it, to help keep it from leaning too badly in turns.

Kris: At least you don't slide over too much stuff that those bolt heads would catch on. :lol:

Not much of a way to recess them there.
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neonrog
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Post by neonrog » Thu Nov 14, 2013 7:03 am

Thanks for clearing that up. I don't want the front too much taller, wouldn't want to get out of alignment as you say. And SRT struts will give more room for a little taller tire. As a Jeep guy, I have friends that suffer from "Inchitis". An affliction that follows the first lift kit and bigger tires...

Yeah I bet those bolt heads can get chewed up. But that is a good argument for the cheap and common hardware. But I doubt he slides on the rocks like the rock crawlers do. Makes me wonder how many bolts have been sheared off...
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webkris
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All Motor Build!

Post by webkris » Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:22 am

Hey guys!
Latest update - Just finished my 2.0l all motor SOHC build.
Planning to test it all out at the Prescott Rally in 2 weeks!

The plan: http://rallynotes.com/2014/07/the-2gn-s ... tor-build/
  • *Ported and polished head (professional job)
    *Upgraded valves and valve springs
    *Crane Cam #12 (158-0012)
    *JE 10.5:1 compression pistons + Eagle rods
    *Adjustable cam gear and mechanical belt tensioner
    *High flow oil pump
    *2GN Intake manifold + throttle body
    *Exhaust manifold
    *Under drive pulley
    *Megasquirt
The execution: http://rallynotes.com/2014/09/the-all-m ... ld-report/

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THE RESULTS! 143HP and 150ft/lbs
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NeonOn19s
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Post by NeonOn19s » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:29 pm

Looks Great!!! Looking forward to how you do at you next event.
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webkris
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2nd in 2WD - Winner of $600 in the 2C (2WD Challenge)

Post by webkris » Thu Oct 16, 2014 1:50 pm

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2nd in 2WD - Winner of $600 in the 2C (2WD Challenge)
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More pics here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/planetkri ... 393990338/

Video:
http://youtu.be/TyeskNQUBHc

New motor ran great! We noticed some weird readings and the car was running a little too rich, we tracked it down to the Intake Air Temp Sensor. Whe we pulled it - it defaults to 70F, and that's exactly what the temps were so we ran like that for the rest of the weekend.

Checkout the video - it has all the data log info from the Megasquirt!
- Kris

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