Saving an 02 Neon R/T

[SittiRT]

Hi everyone,

I made an intro post with a backstory to this car, see here: viewtopic.php?f=36&t=71037

The car is now based at a lockup a short distance from where I live, so whenever I have time I drive over there to work on the Neon. Here are some photos of where she's been living the past few weeks:





I've done a few low cost jobs, like sorting the Multi-Function switch and fitting a replacement wing mirror. But before I really throw any money at this car, the dreaded timing belt needs doing.

So far, my attempts at removing the crank pulley have been...fruitless. The first tool I used snapped at one of the three pulling arms. The second set of tools I used bent at the arms. I have since ordered "BGS 7761", an apparent replica of the OEM Chrysler bearing puller which *should* do the job. Being based in the UK, all this mention of just going round the corner to Autozone doesn't really apply to me!

The car right now is up on axle stands, with the power steering pump moved out of the way, ready for the job to be started. Once I get this pulley off the rest just seems to be a lot of fiddling around but ultimately not too difficult a job. Last time I did a timing belt was on a Fiat X1/9 but the access was WAY better than on the Neon (and having good access is never something I thought I'd say with regards to working on an X1/9...)

Will try to keep updates coming for whoever's remotely interested!

[MyNeonSaysHi]

Awesome! I bet it is very very rare to see a 2nd gen Neon out in the UK. Let along a R/T. I RARELY see 2nd gen R/T's out here in the states now since the car is getting older. Hope you can get that crank pulley off! I am sure some heat will help get it off too.

[SittiRT]

Awesome! I bet it is very very rare to see a 2nd gen Neon out in the UK. Let along a R/T. I RARELY see 2nd gen R/T's out here in the states now since the car is getting older. Hope you can get that crank pulley off! I am sure some heat will help get it off too.

You're right about that, these are super rare here. Registration data shows about 70 2gn R/Ts left on the road in the UK, and they didn't really sell many here to begin with. Although funnily enough, a week after getting the Neon back, I saw another red Neon R/T driving around the small town I live in! Maybe a sign...

So the Chrysler puller worked a charm! At first it didn't grip the pulley properly (these "notches" people mention to grip onto the crank seem non existent...) so with the tactical wedging of some spanners into the gaps behind each jaw of the puller, it came right off. I did the timing belt today, replaced the water pump, camshaft seal, tensioner and tensioner pulley too. Was defeated by the idler pulley though as I didn't have the torx socket for it... Very pleased with how it went though!

[MyNeonSaysHi]

Awesome!
Really cool how you know how many are registered. Crazy you saw another one rolling around.

[occasional demons]

Awesome! I bet it is very very rare to see a 2nd gen Neon out in the UK. Let along a R/T. I RARELY see 2nd gen R/T's out here in the states now since the car is getting older. Hope you can get that crank pulley off! I am sure some heat will help get it off too.

I think all export neons overseas were R/T's. With more features on them, Hence "BUX". (Built Up eXport)

They also cost a lot more than they did in the States, but they added more features to help sell them, and slightly offset the added cost of exporting them. IIRC, Alex Kurdian said his was in the $30,000 neighborhood when new. But that was Australia...

Edit:

I don't recall if nerox ever said what his cost. nerox is one of the few UK members that used to post frequently back in the day.

So,

Got myself a 2nd R/T sometime last year (about October time)

originally bought it with the intent to strip it down for spares and make some £

that was never to be the case ... instead my girlfriend decided she wanted it ... and therefore it had to be repaired.

it had a few problems the owner didn't want to attempt:

leaking coolant pretty bad from an unknown location

FUSE showing on the dash

broken wing mirrors

and a few other annoying little bits.

paid just over £300 ($450) and trailered it to a friends house where its been sat ever since.

the FUSE turned out to be the interior light harness had become disconnected.
the wing mirrors were replaced
and the coolant leak was from the water pump inlet pipe.

Fixed all those problems, also did a complete timing belt job, powder coated the rocker cover, cleaned up inside, replaced all the tatty worn out bits and pieces.

initially I had somehow cracked the original pulley upon removal an replaced it with a DORMAN one from RockAuto (which is also what I have on mine since the same thing happened)
when it was all replaced, 5 minutes went by with the engine running and the alternator belt shredded itself to pieces.
Turned out to be an issue with that pulley, not sure exactly what but I think it was out of round.

by this point I had bought another engine to disassemble and learn from so was able to use that pulley.

it all went back together nicely this time and drove it today to the inspection centre.

only problems with it now are the outer rod ends are worn, a couple of tyres are looking bald too.

it feels a bit different to my R/T (seems a lot less responsive and lacks power) also makes a 'clicking' noise under load when accelerating hard, but it hasn't moved in 6/7 months until now.

Heres how it looked when I picked it up

Just got it home



failed inspection on the rod ends and a little welding required on the sills.

Just got it home

[Midnight_Rider]

To my knowledge, all Neon exports to Europe and the UK were the R/T trim level. Just my .02 worth.

[blueneo03]

This is a cool thread! looking forward to seeing how it all goes!

I really wanted power folding mirrors when i had a neon but the kits that had been put together from the UK were like 300$ which is a lot for mirrors..

[SittiRT]

Thanks for all the interest!

To give an update, the timing belt job is now all done! I did it over two days - I could have done it in the one but I was defeated by the accessory belt pulley of all things, which I needed to get a tougher socket for. The jobs done in the process:

Timing belt
Timing belt hydraulic tensioner
T/belt pulley
Camshaft seal
Water pump (turned out to be the source of the water leak)
Idler pulley
Cleaned inner + outer timing covers, camshaft sprocket + aluminium engine plate
New alt + accessory belts

The job was pretty much how a lot of other people have experienced it: the timing belt component change is pretty straightforward, just GETTING to it was the pain, that plate on the front of the engine really didn't want to come out. I can also confirm that BGS 7761 is tough enough for the crank pulley, but did need some spacers behind the jaws to stop them sliding off (what "notches"?).

It did become apparent as well that the lower torque strut is shot, so I've temporarily fixed it back in place with a mind to ordering a new one. With everything put back together, I changed the coolant, oil, plugs and air filter - and it started right up no problem. Very pleased it all went well on the first go!

I'm probably not going to touch it for the next few days and this weekend as I've missed some trips to the gym because of this job... Plus I'm satisfied that the biggest job this car needs is now done. Next essential job is probably the water leak into the boot and the sloppy gearchange (shifter bushings should sort that)

Photos or it didn't happen, right?:











To answer to the posts above, the export Neons I'm aware were definitely built with a higher spec across the board (powerfold mirrors etc), however the standard models besides the R/T were certainly sold here too, a number have come up for sale recently. For anyone interested have a look at this page showing the amount of Neons in the United Kingdom over time, and how few R/Ts were sold here in the first place! > https://www.howmanyleft.co.uk/?utf8=%E2 ... mit=Search

[Midnight_Rider]

Nice to see someone showing a Neon some love. And thanks for the link- I didn't know that trim levels other than R/T were exported there.

[occasional demons]

Before or after the seal was replaced?



The seal should only go in flush with the head.

But as long as it doesn't leak, it should be fine.

Is it the picture, or is the sealing surface actually dented in looking?

[SittiRT]

Before or after the seal was replaced?



The seal should only go in flush with the head.

But as long as it doesn't leak, it should be fine.

Is it the picture, or is the sealing surface actually dented in looking?

This is post assembly, and no dents on the sealing surface/camshaft, trick of the light I think.

I assumed they were pushed against the 'stop', nevertheless your post got me a bit paranoid so I went to run it again and check. Ran the engine for about half an hour and not a drop of oil appearing. I guess the real test will be a road test but still.

I think the main thing is that it's not in the exact same position as the old seal was, so the new seal is sitting on fresh sealing surface as opposed to the area with 100k miles worth of wear on it.

[SittiRT]

So, following my disappearing act (being active on forums is something I’m working on..) I thought I’d post on the Neon project since the last update.

I’d finished the cambelt/water pump/camshaft seal job and ordered that torque strut I mentioned while I had the car in the “service position”. Glad I’m not doing that job for another 7 years.

Since then I’ve also done the following:

Rebuilt headlight switch to fix flickering foglights (I did this twice. Once with a polyfiller repair to the foglight actuator arm buried within the headlight switch but this wore away after a few months and he problem returned, so glued a thin metal piece there and it’s good so far)

Rewired headlights to take current away from the 12v feed to the lights. My connector is a little melted as they often are but is still functional. Just in time!

Full service, coolant, engine oil, trans oil, filters.

New winter tyres in November

Took the original Silverstone alloys to be powdercoated (very proud of the finish, photos attached)

Fixed steering rack leak with new p/s sensor

Brakes flushed and fluid replaced

Took apart front foglights and applied some reflective tape to repair the wear to the reflective surface. (Not perfect of course but these things are like hens teeth in the UK)

New original radio

Replaced front door speakers and tweeters with aftermarket units, and reapplied the weatherproofing to the doors while I had the door cards off.

Fixed boot (ahem, trunk) leak with silicone rubber applied to the taillight seals.

New booger shifter bushings (old ones had crumbled away)

Intake resonator removed (Prefer the noise this way)

Complete deep clean inside and out, polished and waxed.

Fortunate run in with a very kind ex-Neon owner who donated me an original Mopar rubber trunk liner, 2 sets of original headlight protectors, original tailored carpets, brand new original mudflaps and brand new headlight seals.

Passed MOT (annual vehicle roadworthiness inspection in the UK) with no advisories!


On the list of things to do:

Ordered some Depo black-surround headlights from the US which are on the way.

Still a knocking noise from the front offside wheel. Suspension is all solid and the wheel is firmly attached so no idea. Still need to do some more poking.

Brakes are still a bit soft despite the flush.

Needs an alignment as there is a pull to the left on hard braking at speed.

Chrysler badging is totally worn on the doors. Still looking for an original replacement (I have one but still after another).







Might be a bit better on the posts from now on, who knows

[MyNeonSaysHi]

Wow one big progress post. Love it! Car looks amazing! Great job on cleaning it up! Holy cow!

[JeremyJ]

Looks great. I vote to just remove the door badges and keep them off. It's a cleaner look.

[quicksilvr]

Nice, great work!

[Midnight_Rider]

Keep the door badges! Most people would have no idea of the car being a Chrysler without them. Wheels look fantastic!

[occasional demons]

Aren't overseas neons all Chryslers?

Pretty sure everything RHD is. In the parts catalog, all RHD stuff is designated "Z" for Chrysler, so the wrong items don't get inadvertently ordered.

The badging didn't bother me on my '01, but then being PS2, it didn't really stand out.



I would hate to have to buy those new from a dealer, even at U.S. pricing.

If anything, as far as looks, I would only ditch the "R/T" since it doesn't match the rest of the lettering size. It just looks odd to me.

[SittiRT]

Thanks for the positive messages!

I’ve swayed either way about the badges to be honest... I think overall I do like them but I need to think of a way of restoring them on the car (as they’re made of some sort of rubberised material I’m worried that any attempt to remove would damage them). If by some fluke I do find some original lettering that would be ideal as I’ve already got one brand new emblem for one side.

Yes all Neons in the UK are Chryslers. We have had Dodge branded vehicles in the past (Caliber and Nitro come to mind) but they’re not very common.

[SittiRT]

Hi again,

I'll have some more photos up soon, all this time in lockdown has allowed me to get on with a few other bits and pieces.

I have a question though. I am looking at adding factory cruise control - as it's an export R/T I appear to have all of the wiring ready to go, just need all the components plugging in.

One hiccup however is the cruise control servo, or rather the cable that's supposed to slot in behind the accelerator cable at the throttle body end. I've looked at all the threads on how it's done etc but one thing that comes up is that the MTX and Auto cruise control cables are different. My question is, is there any way of adapting the cable from an auto cruise control unit to attach at an TX throttle body? Or is it just a no-go (like they are totally different lengths for example). I ask because manual cruise control units seem to be more or less extinct in the UK (and Neons are extinct here at the best of times). It's a 2001 Manual R/T as a reminder.

If it helps, PT Cruisers are far more common than Neons here and there are loads of breakers on eBay, if anything is interchangeable...

Thanks!

[occasional demons]

The cable can be removed from the servo. IIRC, the servos are all pretty much the same.

I am not sure how different the ATX and MTX cable ends are at the TB. The 4 speed ATX and MTX TB's are the same in the US market. The 3 speed TB was different due to the kickdown, but the 41TE didn't have a kickdown cable, so they used the same TB as the MTX.

You will probably need the Neon servo bracket, or have to fab a bracket. Being RHD, I am not too familiar with the layout either.

When I added Cruise Control to my '01, I had to fab a bracket to attach the servo to the body, as I think my servo came off of something other than a neon. I made the servo bracket work by making an adapter to mount it to the body. I think the cable was too short also, and I located the proper cable from eBay.

Now this stuff might be harder to source, also being RHD could make it tougher.

If I remember tonight, I will see if I can find the RHD PN's at least for reference, to search on line...

[SittiRT]

That's interesting re. the potential similarities between the 4-speed and the MTX. One of the eBay listings I've been looking at is the cruise control servo w/ cable from a 2002 4-speed...

Should be fine for the bracket as I know a breaker who should have one (same guy I'll be getting the clockspring/wheel controls/vacuum stuff etc from).

[occasional demons]

1 4669 979 1 Z SERVO, Speed Control

2 CABLE, Speed Control
4891 041AA 1 Z
4669 793AB 1 D, P ECB

3 6500 274 4 Z LOCK NUT, M6x1.0x6

4 PLATE, Speed Control Servo
4591 046 1 Z
1 D, P

5 #4669 380AB 1 RESERVOIR, Speed Control Vacuum

6 4669 954 1 Z BRACKET, Speed Control Servo

7 HARNESS, Vacuum Speed Control
#4669 225AB 1 Z Right Hand Drive
#4669 400AC 1 D, P

8 HARNESS, Vacuum Speed Control
#4669 225AB 1 Z Right Hand Drive
#4669 400AC 1 D, P

9 4459 055AB 1 CLIP, Cable Routing

10 SCREW AND WASHER, Hex Head,
M6x1x25, (NOT SERVICED)

11 BRACKET, Speed Control Servo
4669 585AB 1 D, P ECB
4669 954 1 Z Right Hand Drive

-12 3502 916 2 Z SPACER, Speed Control Servo

-13 5214 613 1 EBD, CLIP, Cable
ECB,
ECH,
EJD

-14 4592 032 1 Z ISOLATOR PAD, Speed Control Mounting

I would imagine everything that is designated "Z" is what fits your neon.

[SittiRT]

Thanks this is very helpful.

I’m waiting to hear back from the breaker I’m talking to on what it would cost for everything I need for the cruise control. Seems like installing it is far easier than sourcing all the right parts (At least if like me you have all the wiring there already).

[occasional demons]

With the wiring already in place, it is just plug and play.

My '01 had all the wiring, except for on wire, from the firewall connector under the dash, to the steering column connector. I had to crawl under there and add it in. Everything else was intact.

I also did not use the vacuum reservoir. It has worked fine without it. But possibly having a 60mm throttle body helped out with that, as it does not need to move it as much. But other people have left out the reservoir, and have not had any issue. Given that it almost never opens to WOT, there is usually sufficient vacuum to operate the servo.

Also not in that parts list, is the bottom cover for the steering wheel. You will need that too, as it is cut out for the pods. The second install I did on my '99 with a 2000-2002 steering wheel, I used a Dremel to cut out the holes to mount the the pods. It took a bit of patience, but it turned out pretty well.

That is the one downside with the 2gn's, is they didn't just put in blank pods like the 1gn's had. Also you need to use the 2gn pods, the 1gn pods will not work, even though they they will bolt on. The resistor values are different.

[SittiRT]

Thanks for that, that list came in very handy and I think I have everything I need. Reservoir is installed as is the vacuum line. Switch pods, steering wheel cover and clockspring are ready to go on once I’ve convinced the steering wheel to free itself from the column.

Only issue is the Cruise servo which is supposed to attach to the battery clamp, but I have no idea in what way... parts diagrams show the RHD bracket as just attaching with two nuts, but there’s nothing for them to screw on to! I’m now jus trawling the internet looking for any photo of how its bolted down