help with guage cluster issue.

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Sun Jun 16, 2013 6:43 am

ok.. here is the problem. i got a euro cluster. and a doner cluster to swap the face with a 140 speedo. ... well for some reason the cluster seams to still be reading at 120mph intervals...

example. my speedo shows about 80 mph. and infact i am really running in the 72 mph range...

is there any others that have had this problem? but just a even rt cluster swap? ngc or non ngc make a difference when it comes to rt swap cluster?? i thought they where ran by computer and not really the cluster themselves...

any help would be great. btw. ALL other guages are working properly. such as tach. coolant temp, and fuel.

RayWolf · Post by **RayWolf** » Sun Jun 16, 2013 8:27 pm

did the doner cluster have a 140 speedo on it before you swapped the face? because the motor that moves the needle its calibrated to the original front face has. just swapping the face will not give you a true speed of 140 it will always be 20 miles off

the cluster only get a a positive and negative wire form the computer that carries all the info of the speed and tach.

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Mon Jun 17, 2013 5:59 pm

the doner cluster was a 140mph cluster though... ?????

RayWolf · Post by **RayWolf** » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:50 pm

do you think you put the pointers on wrong after swapping the face.
If you do a cluster cycle check does the needle stop at 35, 70, 110 and 140. if it does not then the needle is on wrong. if it only does for a few numbers then you need to replace the needle motor.

to check the cluster is shut all the doors and hold the trip button and turn on the key, after you turn the key to on releice the button and the needles will cycle.

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:58 pm

ok. cycle tested ok. 35, 70 110 140....

i never touched the needles. i just unhooked the face and plugged it into a usa cluster. .

it seams odd that the sweep it testing the correct numbers. yet the accuall speed is incorrect...

i am guessing if lets say i put a 120mph backing on it the speeds would read different correct during the sweep test?

orangeneon05 · Post by **orangeneon05** » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:56 am

ill try to help you as im facing similar issues when i swapped my srt cluster in.

there are two main components in the clusters:

1. the "back board" computer board that holds the bulbs and plugs into the dash plug. there are three different ones that i know of, 120, 140, 160. each of these different "back boards" need to be with the correct MPH front.

2. the gauge face, is the front of the gauge that holds the motor, needles, and the face of the gauge. this comes in many more styles because of the different models of neon. the most popular are the 120, 140, 160. this board also houses the odo board, which is screwed to the face.

some helpful info for the initial troubleshooting:

to make a correct MPH cluster you need to have the same front and back for the gauges to read true. also the gauge sweep will work because it moves to the 25%, 50%, 75%, and 100% positions. it will show correctly on the sweep check because the sweep paths of all the gauges are the same distance no matter the max MPH.

also for those that want to swap a gauge but not have different odo readings, you will need to flash the clusters to make the odo true. if you can find someone that will do it they can only ADD miles so keep that in mind when you are going to get a new cluster.

so basically you need the 140 "back board" and the 140 front for the gauge style you want.

if you have that and its not working im not sure what might be wrong with it but some one does im sure.

RayWolf · Post by **RayWolf** » Tue Jun 18, 2013 7:46 pm

what tires are you running are you running stock or larger than what your door has recommended. cause your speedo can be off because of that.

or your speedo gear is the wrong or broken

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:40 pm

i have not had this issue with the speed before the cluster swap. i am wondering if the cluster i got from a guy on the forum had a 140 face. but a 120 rear board...

i had a 120 mph speedo last year. but my mph was correct.... since the 140swap my mph is off. .

is there any numbers on the back board that will tell me if it is a 120 mph or a 140??

orangeneon05 · Post by **orangeneon05** » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:03 pm

AFAIK there is no indication....

an easy test would be to put the 120 front on the 140 board and see if mph is true.

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:32 pm

ok . i can do that . i will let everyone know what i find out when i get time to pull it apart and work on it.

thanks guys for your help

orangeneon05 · Post by **orangeneon05** » Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:13 pm

no problem that is what we are here for!

Gnuserup · Post by **Gnuserup** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:12 pm

Do you mean the plate with backboard ?

Then there should be a number - e.g.

on a autostick-cluster.

If you have some more questions - I could maybe have a look - I have some different clusters here.

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 8:11 pm

i will try to explain as easy as i can. the white plastic peace(the back) i pulled from the front (black peace) unplugged them. and swapped them directly. i was wondering if i can get a bord number that would tell me if it was a 140 BACK or if it is a 120mph speedo. .

the cardbord type peace on the back of the cluster are part numbered the same ... but that maybe a universal back bord.. the bord in the cluster itself is prolly the difference. . .

if you can take a look at a 140mph bord and a 120mph bord i in interested to see if the board numbers are different. then i can check it in my garage and not have to worry about getting another car to drive with me to test speeds.

thanks alot.

i have been crazy busy and pulling the car is prolly out for a week or more....

Gnuserup · Post by **Gnuserup** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:28 pm

I only found a picture of the BUX-240 km/h board I made time ago

and it has no number on its "face"

just a little sticker on the back which says "2XGAZ1"

(top right corner on the picture)

What kind of euro-cluster do you have if you say it goes to 140 ?

Is it from uk ?

I have one of those but unfortunatelly took no picture from the plate ...

But as you can see in the picture above, the ABS-light stays on (and the (!) ) when I tried the cluster in a different neon. Can´t remember if it was the SXT but think so.

So maybe it could work if you put a ABS lamp in the cluster you have and watch it if it lights or not ( in case your neon comes with no ABS). Nearly every neon in germany comes with ABS, so there is a light and so the light stays on if you put the cluster in a no-ABS-neon.

Is there anywhere a neon with 120 mph-cluster and ABS ?!?
Or a neon with 140 mph-cluster and no ABS ?

Anyway I could take a closer look onto the UK-cluster soon, for the us-120 mph I´m too lazy to get it out actually ...

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:14 pm

yes. mine is a uk 140 black face just like yours picture. my abs light is not on. but if i remember right i pulled the bulb before installing... and yes my (!) light is on aswell. going to pul that bulb when i pull the cluster...

i am going to pull it out maybe tomorrow after work. i have a 140 mph face. and a 120 mph face downstairs. the uk cluster i have the backing would not read anything. hence why i had to change the backing...

Gnuserup · Post by **Gnuserup** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 3:38 pm

You would need the (!) light for the brake-warning-issues IIRMC. There has been a how-to anywhere to keep the light off when not needed. Some wires soldering anyhow.

Your uk-cluster won´t work ? So no speed or rpm is shown ?

dtjackten · Post by **dtjackten** » Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:51 pm

no. a plug and play it will not work. I get no gauges that work. temp, gas. rpm. and speedo. . I removed the stock uk board and put the what should have been a 140 mph speedo board and it is still not working.

btw. I just pulled the bulb out when I had the cluster out for the (!) light to go out.

I have removed the uk cluster and installed a 120 mph cluster. to see if that is working correctly to make sure that it is not a mechanical issue. unfortunately it rained today and I did not take the car out for testing. going to take my other cluster and switch out boards and what on when I have a car and driver to help with testing the speedo. hoping the weather is ok tomorrow so I can test it out..

Gnuserup · Post by **Gnuserup** » Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:10 pm

All I learned until now is that any cluster I was trying had been working. Maybe you saw my thread with the autostickcluster and esp. the PT cluster last few weeks.
So if a us PT Cluster with autostick works in a BUX neon with manual transmission, a UK neon cluster must work in your us neon.
At least my UK-one did.

Maybe your the plate of yours really is defective and/ or you should try the parallel cluster-OBD-thing for testing ...

If the gauges you mentioned won´t work it might be a bus-problem on the uk plate.

Last chance would be to compare the pinouts. I can´t imagine, that there would be a uk cluster with a different pinout, but anyway.
Easiest try to locate the ground and the turnsignal pins and power them up. If they will work (light up) as expectet, the pci-pin should be at the right space as well.

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Mon Jul 01, 2013 12:49 pm

It must have something to do with the difference between the 120 and 140 MPH clusters. I used the euro gauges with my ACR circuit board (to keep my mileage) and everything works perfectly.