Thinking of going with nitrous

[kc2005ptgt]

Ok, so after mych consideration and contempation, I am thinking about doing a 50-75 shot of nitrous oxide. I have a few questions about the subject, and after some research here and on Neons.org, I have come to the conclusion that it is subject to each persons own personal taste as to what 'brand' to use. I will probably go with NOS, considering I can get it locally, and for a decent price.

My real question is this, where can I find info on install specific to our cars, and what about info on which is best; dry, wet, direct port? Also, those of you who have N2O, is a 50 to high, or will I start blowing things up after that? What should I upgrade, injectors? fuel rail? anything at all? Will a comp 400 cam work with a N2O setup?

is there any realiable online sources with FAQ's on N20 also?

Thanks y'all


drew

[lambostealth]

Having installed several different kits, I can say they are pretty much all the same (except Zex, and that kit sucks), I prefer the NX kit. Install is really straight forward, the instructions are pretty clear, just buy any WET single fogger EFI kit (way more reliable). And make sure you pick up some liquid plumbers teflon to seal all of your threads. As far as output, they say that no more than 30% of your factory HP is recommended when you have cast internals (which you do), if you have forged internals, they say no more that 60%. So for you, you should be looking at about a 35 but you could do 50-max. Just make sure your fuel system is up to snuff, replace fuel filter, get the pressure checked, don't bother changing your injectors, it will just run like crap off the juice, and probably wil run the same on juice. The only thing you might change, but isn't necessary by any means, is your fuel rail, so that the fuel solenoid has more fuel at hand and gives a less chance of running lean and putting a hole in your pistons!!

In all honesty, Nitrous, is a completely safe method of adding power, as long as the rest of the car is up to snuff (fuel, and ignition mainly). Just remember it is like any other power adder, just like crack, YOU WILL WANT MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EDIT: The cam should be fine with N2O.

I have also found that most nitrous kits are jetted pretty rich, so I normally install a wideband (temporarily) on the cars I install on, and the fuel jet can almost always go down one size, but I have seen some that you can go two sizes down, and that normally puts the quoted HP out at the wheels........but never do that without a wideband!!!

[INVUJerry]

Basically, our magic number is 250wtq or so. We put out 120 or so to the ground, you possibly more since you're a magnum. You could use a wet 75 shot safely, but thats a bit much, I'd stick with a 50 or so.

[unsuper man]

50max?

lmao.
while i believe you may have installed all those kits, your tuning/re-world knowledge of nitrous is slightly lacking...

boy, where to start...



1. 50max isnt even close to max. i ran a 75hot thru my NX kit for over a year. and that was a year of pure abuse. my only mods were longtube, exhuast, intake, MSD ignition, and upd. other then that the motor was stock. now, that was a 75shot at 950psi. if my bottle pressure was at 950psi, i wouldnt bother racing, because i felt it was to low, i ran 1000-1500psi when i used my kit. so i was putting out quite a bit more hp then 75...

2. never go down a size in fuel jetting. all kits are designed to run at a pressure of 950psi. so while dropping the fuel jet a size seems ok at 950psi, if the bottle pressure spikes, (like it does in fla daily) youll run lean.

3. you for NO reason need a new fuel rail. at all. if the car runs, it has fuel pressure. if your worried, get a FPSS. also a window switch helps alot too. i bounced the limiter plenty of times when i was spraying, and the window switch saved me everytime. including the time i went from 3rd to 2nd on the drag strip while spraying..

4. dont listen to what you read on the interweb, as 90% of it is bullshit, infact, ignore me, i may be filling your head with lies too. start with a 25shot, and go till you feel that your done. plenty of members run 90-100 shot jets on stock bottom end neons, i personily wouldnt for daily use, but like i said, i was running well over 75hp when i did. and i ran thru 1-2 bottles a week, so i didnt want to chance a 100shot. if i was easier on the bottle, i would have, but i dont recomend you too. thats your dicsion when the time comes.

youll need a clutch in time, tho my stock worked fine forever. after 20k miles on nitrous, i went to turbo and after some abuse there, it started a mild slip. tho most members will tell you itll slip after on a 50shot, i chalk that up to poor driving habits. be easy on the clutch, itll last forever.

install is simple. but dont get a NOS kit, sspend the little extra, and get NX. the NX get i had, its purge soliniod was larger then most nos kits fuel/n20 noids. thats just sad.

u run a line off the fuel rail to the fuel noid, then from there to the fuel side of the nozzle. the bottle line runs from the bottle to the noid, then from there to the n20 side of the nozzle. wire it up with a relay and WOT switch, and add any safty switchs you orderd. placing the nozzle closer to the motor will make the shot softer, and less apperent. itlll still work the same, but if you put the nozzle near the filter, youll feel the hit when enguaging the ntrous, which can cause wheel spin, or POSSIBLY engine damage. so just run it close. i had mine in the bellows tube between the manifold and TB. worked fine. remeber not to hit the limiter unless u have a window switch, and dont spray below 3000rpm. mostly because the motor isnt moving enoght air to proper distribute the nitrous. and tq would be outragously high.

im sure alter on, ill post more. but im doenfor now.

[ChrisRT]

Ok, now, for something you can read.

Nitrous is cheap, and easy HP & TRQ.

I wouldn't go much over a 75 shot on a stock bottom end neon, and even then I'd use 100 octane gas, just for a little extra insurance!

Install with an NX kit(thats what I use), is pretty straight forward.

Line off the fuel rail to the fuel solenoid.
Nitrous line off bottle to nitrous solenoid.
Some people run filters for their nitrous, i'm one of them. I also run a fuel pressure kill switch, where if the FP drops drasticlly, it kills the nitrous system. Sure, you may have lost the race, but you just saved your engine.

Then its the wiring, pretty easy and straight forward as well. 12v switchable source(s), a switch to arm the nitrous, and a WOT switch or a button to use it. I prefer WOT switches.

Most companies, espically NX, jet rich for fuel so as not to cause issues with peoples cars/warranty/blah blah blah.

Most of the guys I know, go down one jet on the fuel. It really makes the mixture about perfect.

As for bottle pressure. NX recommends 1000PSi, IIRC, NOS is 850. the higher the pressure, the more nitrous flowing. I like to run between 1050-1200PSI.

A purge is recommended for a harder "hitting" system, but not needed. I use a purge.

Lastly. Shop around. You can put together a really nice, really good nitrous kit for under 500 dollars. I've got around 700 into mine, but, i've got extra solenoids, extra purge valves, jets from 35-250 shot. Plenty of extra lines, a blow down tube(needed if bottle is mounted in the car), bottle heater and bottle blanket, as well as bottle brackets, two nozzles, and plenty of other stuff.

If you haven't figured it out, I'm sort of a nitrous junkie. lol

As for 75 vs. other larger shots. Heres my take.

75 shot is about the same, E.T. wise as a 100 shot. Guys with Dak R/T's are seeing between 1.0 and 1.2 seconds off their E.T with a 75 shot. A 100 shot is around 1.2-1.4 seconds. However, is the extra couple of tenths, worth the extra abuse on the engine? To me, no.

Plus, if you ever street race, you tell people you have a small shot, and they'll believe you. 75 isn't alot, but its enough to do the job. You start throwing around triple digit numbers, and people either (a) think you're faster than you are, or (b) won't race you because of that magical number.

I run a number of sizes from 75-125-150. I'm not a huge fan of the 150, but, 600lb-ft of torque at the wheels is hard to argue with, and ALOT more fun to drive

[lambostealth]

50max?

lmao.
while i believe you may have installed all those kits, your tuning/re-world knowledge of nitrous is slightly lacking...

boy, where to start...



1. 50max isnt even close to max. i ran a 75hot thru my NX kit for over a year. and that was a year of pure abuse. my only mods were longtube, exhuast, intake, MSD ignition, and upd. other then that the motor was stock. now, that was a 75shot at 950psi. if my bottle pressure was at 950psi, i wouldnt bother racing, because i felt it was to low, i ran 1000-1500psi when i used my kit. so i was putting out quite a bit more hp then 75...

2. never go down a size in fuel jetting. all kits are designed to run at a pressure of 950psi. so while dropping the fuel jet a size seems ok at 950psi, if the bottle pressure spikes, (like it does in fla daily) youll run lean.

3. you for NO reason need a new fuel rail. at all. if the car runs, it has fuel pressure. if your worried, get a FPSS. also a window switch helps alot too. i bounced the limiter plenty of times when i was spraying, and the window switch saved me everytime. including the time i went from 3rd to 2nd on the drag strip while spraying..

4. dont listen to what you read on the interweb, as 90% of it is bullshit, infact, ignore me, i may be filling your head with lies too. start with a 25shot, and go till you feel that your done. plenty of members run 90-100 shot jets on stock bottom end neons, i personily wouldnt for daily use, but like i said, i was running well over 75hp when i did. and i ran thru 1-2 bottles a week, so i didnt want to chance a 100shot. if i was easier on the bottle, i would have, but i dont recomend you too. thats your dicsion when the time comes.

youll need a clutch in time, tho my stock worked fine forever. after 20k miles on nitrous, i went to turbo and after some abuse there, it started a mild slip. tho most members will tell you itll slip after on a 50shot, i chalk that up to poor driving habits. be easy on the clutch, itll last forever.

install is simple. but dont get a NOS kit, sspend the little extra, and get NX. the NX get i had, its purge soliniod was larger then most nos kits fuel/n20 noids. thats just sad.

u run a line off the fuel rail to the fuel noid, then from there to the fuel side of the nozzle. the bottle line runs from the bottle to the noid, then from there to the n20 side of the nozzle. wire it up with a relay and WOT switch, and add any safty switchs you orderd. placing the nozzle closer to the motor will make the shot softer, and less apperent. itlll still work the same, but if you put the nozzle near the filter, youll feel the hit when enguaging the ntrous, which can cause wheel spin, or POSSIBLY engine damage. so just run it close. i had mine in the bellows tube between the manifold and TB. worked fine. remeber not to hit the limiter unless u have a window switch, and dont spray below 3000rpm. mostly because the motor isnt moving enoght air to proper distribute the nitrous. and tq would be outragously high.

im sure alter on, ill post more. but im doenfor now.

NEVER, EVER, MOUNT YOUR NOZZLE AFTER THE THROTTLE BODY!!!!!

If you have N2O solenoid leak, you get no warning, BOOOOM!!!!!

[atom]

NEVER, EVER, MOUNT YOUR NOZZLE AFTER THE THROTTLE BODY!!!!!

If you have N2O solenoid leak, you get no warning, BOOOOM!!!!!

That's actually what I was going to say, I don't even use nitrous but I read it off the ZEX site a couple days ago.

[kc2005ptgt]

I wouldn't go much over a 75 shot on a stock bottom end neon, and even then I'd use 100 octane gas, just for a little extra insurance!

I will probably go with a 50 shot max.

Then its the wiring, pretty easy and straight forward as well. 12v switchable source(s), a switch to arm the nitrous, and a WOT switch or a button to use it. I prefer WOT switches.

Stupid question, but are you talking about a switch like (please do not kill me) those steering wheel mounted 'buttons'? Or what?

Most companies, espically NX, jet rich for fuel so as not to cause issues with peoples cars/warranty/blah blah blah.

Most of the guys I know, go down one jet on the fuel. It really makes the mixture about perfect.

What is "one jet on the fuel"?

A purge is recommended for a harder "hitting" system, but not needed. I use a purge.

Purge, like the blow off from that cool video where it comes out the Ram's nose?

Lastly. Shop around. You can put together a really nice, really good nitrous kit for under 500 dollars. I've got around 700 into mine, but, i've got extra solenoids, extra purge valves, jets from 35-250 shot. Plenty of extra lines, a blow down tube(needed if bottle is mounted in the car), bottle heater and bottle blanket, as well as bottle brackets, two nozzles, and plenty of other stuff.

Remote opener; is that neccessary? I do not plan on needing to drive around the street with it open, but it would be nice to open it without jumping out, etc...
also, can n2o be run with an exhaust cut out? I assume yes.

[FTWNeon]

Then its the wiring, pretty easy and straight forward as well. 12v switchable source(s), a switch to arm the nitrous, and a WOT switch or a button to use it. I prefer WOT switches.

Stupid question, but are you talking about a switch like (please do not kill me) those steering wheel mounted 'buttons'? Or what?

I'MA CUT YOU!!!!

heh

Anywho, WOT switch is a switch you mount on the throttle body and when you go Wide Open Throttle (Floor it) it activates the switch and then sprays.

[ChrisRT]

Stupid question, but are you talking about a switch like (please do not kill me) those steering wheel mounted 'buttons'? Or what?

Yes, you can use those. A WOT switch is mounted on the TB, where the spring is, when you go WOT, it completes the circuit, sending "juice" to the 'noids, and then nitrous out of the 'noids and into the nozzle.

What is "one jet on the fuel"?

Nitrous and Fuel are measured in "jets", for wet kits, that is.

I should have said one jet size, but, yeah. They're different sizes(openings) for the nitrous and fuel to flow through.

Purge, like the blow off from that cool video where it comes out the Ram's nose?

Probably. Yes.

Remote opener; is that neccessary? I do not plan on needing to drive around the street with it open, but it would be nice to open it without jumping out, etc...
also, can n2o be run with an exhaust cut out? I assume yes.

Nitrous can be run with a cutout.

Remote opener is a personal prefernce. I don't run one, but, instead, I mount my bottle behind the seat of my truck, in a gym bag. Unless you really look, you're not going to find it. All i have to do is reach behind the seat, and crack it open. Yes, this is a bad idea, I know, but it is/was the easiest for me to do at the time, and still be stealthy.

[quicksilvr]

Having installed several different kits, I can say they are pretty much all the same (except Zex, and that kit sucks), I prefer the NX kit.

Why does the ZEX suck? I was planning on ZEX....but maybe not anymore. I hadn't heard any negative's for the ZEX until now. I was planning on using a ZEX wet kit, but with an upgraded Cold Fusion bottle and valve. Would you still recomend an NX wet kit instead?

[INVUJerry]

linky!

Rental Neon + Nitrous = fun.

[unsuper man]

50max?

lmao.
while i believe you may have installed all those kits, your tuning/re-world knowledge of nitrous is slightly lacking...

boy, where to start...



1. 50max isnt even close to max. i ran a 75hot thru my NX kit for over a year. and that was a year of pure abuse. my only mods were longtube, exhuast, intake, MSD ignition, and upd. other then that the motor was stock. now, that was a 75shot at 950psi. if my bottle pressure was at 950psi, i wouldnt bother racing, because i felt it was to low, i ran 1000-1500psi when i used my kit. so i was putting out quite a bit more hp then 75...

2. never go down a size in fuel jetting. all kits are designed to run at a pressure of 950psi. so while dropping the fuel jet a size seems ok at 950psi, if the bottle pressure spikes, (like it does in fla daily) youll run lean.

3. you for NO reason need a new fuel rail. at all. if the car runs, it has fuel pressure. if your worried, get a FPSS. also a window switch helps alot too. i bounced the limiter plenty of times when i was spraying, and the window switch saved me everytime. including the time i went from 3rd to 2nd on the drag strip while spraying..

4. dont listen to what you read on the interweb, as 90% of it is bullshit, infact, ignore me, i may be filling your head with lies too. start with a 25shot, and go till you feel that your done. plenty of members run 90-100 shot jets on stock bottom end neons, i personily wouldnt for daily use, but like i said, i was running well over 75hp when i did. and i ran thru 1-2 bottles a week, so i didnt want to chance a 100shot. if i was easier on the bottle, i would have, but i dont recomend you too. thats your dicsion when the time comes.

youll need a clutch in time, tho my stock worked fine forever. after 20k miles on nitrous, i went to turbo and after some abuse there, it started a mild slip. tho most members will tell you itll slip after on a 50shot, i chalk that up to poor driving habits. be easy on the clutch, itll last forever.

install is simple. but dont get a NOS kit, sspend the little extra, and get NX. the NX get i had, its purge soliniod was larger then most nos kits fuel/n20 noids. thats just sad.

u run a line off the fuel rail to the fuel noid, then from there to the fuel side of the nozzle. the bottle line runs from the bottle to the noid, then from there to the n20 side of the nozzle. wire it up with a relay and WOT switch, and add any safty switchs you orderd. placing the nozzle closer to the motor will make the shot softer, and less apperent. itlll still work the same, but if you put the nozzle near the filter, youll feel the hit when enguaging the ntrous, which can cause wheel spin, or POSSIBLY engine damage. so just run it close. i had mine in the bellows tube between the manifold and TB. worked fine. remeber not to hit the limiter unless u have a window switch, and dont spray below 3000rpm. mostly because the motor isnt moving enoght air to proper distribute the nitrous. and tq would be outragously high.

im sure alter on, ill post more. but im doenfor now.

NEVER, EVER, MOUNT YOUR NOZZLE AFTER THE THROTTLE BODY!!!!!

If you have N2O solenoid leak, you get no warning, BOOOOM!!!!!

i hope your kidding. get a soliniod siezed open, and the nozzle can be in the filter, its still taking out your motor. what warning are you talking about, because i for one didnt get the little light in my instrument cluster that let me know when nitrous was flowing thru my motor, maybe i got screwed? also, i guess direct port kits are TERRIBLY HORRIBLIY designed, because they mount NUMEROUS nozzles behind the TB...

[quicksilvr]

But why does the ZEX kit suck??????????

[J-Villa]

nitrous is like a really hot girl with an std....You know you wanna hit it, but your affraid of the consequences lol

[kc2005ptgt]

I hope this doesnt turn into a personal pissing contest between a couple of people who know so much about this subject.

I appreciate the responses guys! And yeah, I wanna know like Dave asked, why does ZEX suck? And what is wrong with NOS? Is it not as good as other kits for what reasons? What kit out there is cheapest, easy to install, and a decent product? I do not want to blow up my engine, but I want the extra boost It sounds so fun. A buddy of mine has it on his Acura (b18 swapped) and it is bad! So, I must have it - after I upgrade a few components - mainly exhaust.

Thanks again!

[unsuper man]

zex sucks because u pay 500$s+ for a kit, 300 of which is for the controll box which contains all soliniods. but if something fails, your out on the whole box, as where a reg kit, u replace what broke. plus it runs off a weird tps setup that i dont trust.


nos noids are just cheap and small. stick with nx.

[ChrisRT]

I hope this doesnt turn into a personal pissing contest between a couple of people who know so much about this subject.

I appreciate the responses guys! And yeah, I wanna know like Dave asked, why does ZEX suck? And what is wrong with NOS? Is it not as good as other kits for what reasons? What kit out there is cheapest, easy to install, and a decent product? I do not want to blow up my engine, but I want the extra boost It sounds so fun. A buddy of mine has it on his Acura (b18 swapped) and it is bad! So, I must have it - after I upgrade a few components - mainly exhaust.

Thanks again!

Cheap and Nitrous is a bad idea. You pay for what you get. It can be had cheaply, but you have to piece together your kit.

If you're going to buy a new kit out right, i'd go with an NX Gen2 kit for around 700 bucks. It has EVERYTHING you'd need.

[03blackrt]

Are the Nitrous Express MainLine EFI Nitrous Systems kits anygood as a starter kit?

Perhaps this was covered somewhere, but what is the average fill-up cost for a 10lb bottle?

[ChrisRT]

I think nitrous is around 4-5 dollars/lb these days.

That NX kit seems to be a good base kit.

[03blackrt]

I know that there are alot of varables but any gusses as to how many "50 shots" (50 or less) a neon could do with 10lbs?

Costing $40-$50 for 10lbs for only a couple of runs might sway me into getting a different car (camaro, trans-am, corvette, or an older mopar!) that would have power all the time.

EDIT: found my answer....

Q. How long will a bottle of nitrous last?

A. That depends on the level of power being produced. The formula for calculating your nitrous usage is: 0.8 lbs N2O X 10 seconds = 100 horsepower. I.E. If your system is jetted for 100 horsepower it will use 0.8 lbs of nitrous for every 10 seconds of usage.

[lambostealth]

I know that there are alot of varables but any gusses as to how many "50 shots" (50 or less) a neon could do with 10lbs?

Costing $40-$50 for 10lbs for only a couple of runs might sway me into getting a different car (camaro, trans-am, corvette, or an older mopar!) that would have power all the time.

EDIT: found my answer....

Q. How long will a bottle of nitrous last?

A. That depends on the level of power being produced. The formula for calculating your nitrous usage is: 0.8 lbs N2O X 10 seconds = 100 horsepower. I.E. If your system is jetted for 100 horsepower it will use 0.8 lbs of nitrous for every 10 seconds of usage.

I know on the past kits I've installed, it's roughly 1lb. every 10 seconds, per 100hp.

[03blackrt]

Cool, so i could assume about 28-20 (35hp-50hp) 1/4 mile runs per 10lbs assuming 10sec of NO2 use each run (although probley less then 10 sec of NO2 use) and about $2.00 - $2.50 per 10 seconds of butt spanking @ $4-$5/lb!

2000 butt spankings = turbo/srt swap/$4k-5K

[i think my math is correct ]

[ChrisRT]

Wait, a 50 shot is half of a 100 shot, you're looking at like 4000 or so spankings.

[LowNSlow]

I ran a 75 shot of wet NX through my 04 SXT... only mods were header/exhaust/intake...

Ran like a raped ape. All I did was go 1 step colder on my plugs and she was fine.

[03blackrt]

if i still have my r/t this winter it will be getting intake/head porting, decking, and n ow most likely NO2 too.

[03blackrt]

Wait, a 50 shot is half of a 100 shot, you're looking at like 4000 or so spankings.

no, i took that into account. about 20 shots (@ 50hp) or 28 shots (@ 35hp) with 10lbs @ 10sec each shot.



would someone like to explain how a nitrous system operates (or provide a suitable link). this system im looking at is "push-button activated". so there is a on/off switch that turns the system on/off and then a "go" button that injects nitrous? how does the nitrous "deactivate"? would it just keep spraying until you hit the button agian (or release the button?)? what happens when you hit the rev-limiter and are spraying? can you shift while you spray?

is a blow down tube nessasary? i would assume a "Fuel Pressure Safety Switch" would be a good safty investment?



I am such a nitous noob

[lambostealth]

Wait, a 50 shot is half of a 100 shot, you're looking at like 4000 or so spankings.

no, i took that into account. about 20 shots (@ 50hp) or 28 shots (@ 35hp) with 10lbs @ 10sec each shot.



would someone like to explain how a nitrous system operates (or provide a suitable link). this system im looking at is "push-button activated". so there is a on/off switch that turns the system on/off and then a "go" button that injects nitrous?

YES

how does the nitrous "deactivate"?

YOU LET GO OF THE BUTTON

would it just keep spraying until you hit the button agian (or release the button?)?

RELEASE BUTTON

what happens when you hit the rev-limiter and are spraying?

BOOM!

can you shift while you spray?

YES, IF YOU WANT THE ABOVE TO HAPPEN.......BOOM!!

is a blow down tube nessasary?

ONLY AT RACETRACKS

i would assume a "Fuel Pressure Safety Switch" would be a good safty investment?


ABSOLUTELY, BUT IT IS NOT NECESSARY AT ALL, AS LONG AS YOUR FUEL SYSTEM IS UP TO SNUFF (CLEAN FILTER ETC.,) YOU WILL BE FINE



I am such a nitous noob

[03blackrt]

i would assume a "Fuel Pressure Safety Switch" would be a good safty investment?


ABSOLUTELY, BUT IT IS NOT NECESSARY AT ALL, AS LONG AS YOUR FUEL SYSTEM IS UP TO SNUFF (CLEAN FILTER ETC.,) YOU WILL BE FINE

so the stock fuel pump is ample for a 50 shot?



and thanks, that clears up alot for me.

[lambostealth]

i would assume a "Fuel Pressure Safety Switch" would be a good safty investment?


ABSOLUTELY, BUT IT IS NOT NECESSARY AT ALL, AS LONG AS YOUR FUEL SYSTEM IS UP TO SNUFF (CLEAN FILTER ETC.,) YOU WILL BE FINE

so the stock fuel pump is ample for a 50 shot?



and thanks, that clears up alot for me.

I'm pretty sure the stock fuel pump would be fine up to a 100 shot, but I wouldn' hold it for the entire quarter, maybe just last gear or two