udp and system

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:39 pm

can you run a under drive pulley and still have a decent aftermarket stereo system , i am worried that the udp will not trun the alternator fast enough to keep the electrical sytem charged much less my system, its not a huge system, 400 watt 4 channel for my highs, 1200 watt for my 2 12' subs. those numbers are peak wattage, the current draw is 50 amps max for both but i dont see the 4 channel pulling much more than 10. any onfo like running a udp and a stronger alt. like a 210 amp one or equivilant.

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:54 pm

I have a system with my mpx udp and it still charges really good i was actually susprised.

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:58 pm

wurd, i got the auto but i dont think that has any bearing on this situation

esteinmaier · Post by **esteinmaier** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:54 pm

It may still charge just fine, but you'll wear out your alternator faster.

dblsg · Post by **dblsg** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 12:09 pm

03+ neons came with a higher output alternator, so depends on what year you have. i have a udp and and run a 700 watt amp, but i'm only pushing one 12... but i'm also running in on-board air compressor. my volt gauge reads an average of 14 volts when the car is running... if i turn the rear defrost on, it will drop to about 12.5 (but only at idle).

so to answer your question... i say no problem, although you might wanna upgrade your ground wires and get a cap.

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 1:09 pm

cool yeah i was reading that some of the newer 2gen have 120 amp alts thats not bad for fact. the headlights do dim a bit with the ac on and the system cranked, but i am going to get a cap and the ground kit to see what happens, also i am going to upgrade the alt wire as it looks to only be 10gauge maybe at that, if this dont help i will get a 250 or higher amp just to have a little extra playing room, also with as aftermarket alt you can run a slightly higher voltage maybe 16 peak and your ingniton will thank you.

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 1:39 pm

Your alternator is regulated by the ecu so it wont let it go above i think 14.4 volts. If you have the 120amp alternator you should be fine. I'm pushing close to 3000 watt RMS and the lowest the volts drop to at idle when the bass hits hard is around 11.5 and i have the 85 amp alternator.

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 2:37 pm

my man if you have a 3000 watt rms amp a true 3000watt r.m.s. amp you would have fried your batt or alt or both by now, my old 1501d made by mtx only pulled 1500 rms and i had to run a 275 alt 2 batteries and a 5 farad cap. i am sure if its a lesser brand ie audibahn, or so it is prob. way overatted. not to say your stuff is no good, i am sure it sounds very loud but there is no way you got a true 3000 watt r.m.s. amp on factory charging equipment. look at the amp and see how many fuses there are and what amperage each one is, add them toghther and that is roughly the most amperage it will pull period. hell 1501d was direct current meaning it had no fuses and 0awg wire was run. 3000 watts is a shit load of power if that is what you truley have.

NiteHawk · Post by **NiteHawk** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:42 pm

one thing to remember about udp's people. when you install an udp, it just means that your accessories wont be at 100% AT IDLE. once you're moving and rpm's are above about 1500-2000, your accessories will all be working as if there never was an udp even installed.....

I've had my udp on for a while, and I had a large system with a 2400W rms amp for my subs and a 600W amp for my highs...battery stayed charged without question(other than on really hard low notes you could feel the power drain because the car would lose power(literally, the car would accelorate slower).

Dont ever be afraid of installing an udp with a system

its safe

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 11:38 pm

yellowsxt23 wrote:my man if you have a 3000 watt rms amp a true 3000watt r.m.s. amp you would have fried your batt or alt or both by now, my old 1501d made by mtx only pulled 1500 rms and i had to run a 275 alt 2 batteries and a 5 farad cap. i am sure if its a lesser brand ie audibahn, or so it is prob. way overatted. not to say your stuff is no good, i am sure it sounds very loud but there is no way you got a true 3000 watt r.m.s. amp on factory charging equipment. look at the amp and see how many fuses there are and what amperage each one is, add them toghther and that is roughly the most amperage it will pull period. hell 1501d was direct current meaning it had no fuses and 0awg wire was run. 3000 watts is a shit load of power if that is what you truley have.

I know 3000 watts rms is alot. I'm using MA Audio amps. When the voltage drops i know i'm not getting that much power but i still should be getting somewhere around 2200- 2500 watts rms at 12-13 volts. Like said in the above post you can literally feel the car accelerate slower because of the load from the alternator.

dblsg · Post by **dblsg** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:04 am

white2000neon wrote: I know 3000 watts rms is alot. I'm using MA Audio amps. When the voltage drops i know i'm not getting that much power but i still should be getting somewhere around 2200- 2500 watts rms at 12-13 volts. Like said in the above post you can literally feel the car accelerate slower because of the load from the alternator.

i'm raising the flag.... 2200 is still a whole hella ubber lot of wattege. now i'm not saying its not possible, but it is a little hard to swallow.... any pics by chance?

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 9:26 am

my cardomain its on the www at the bottom of my posts, but the pics i have arent the greatest of it.

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:03 pm

ma audio makes decnet stuff if its there upperend stuff but man its virually impossible to pull that kind of wattge, see when you get into that much power a amp HAS TO! pull a large amount of wattage as well even class d amps that are very efficient pull a large amount at that power level no say you do have the 120 amp fact. alt. a 3000 watt rms again true 3000 watt rms amp not just casue its printed on the side of the amp but has been bench tested at that amount 300 watts rms will easily pull 125 or above amps on hard notes and probably pull a steady 75 to 80 on normal volumes, if that is so ur only gettin 40 amps max to the rest of your car for ac, lights, dash lights, computer, and ignition, hell i think the fact. ac pulls like 35 alone, pop ur hood and look at the ground and power wires runnin to ur battery there only 10 or 8 awg now if ur alt only has that goin to ur batt and ur runnin 0 awg to ur amp which you should be with that much power it will take a matter of min before your batt is completely drained, then your runnin on straight alt power then all of the sudden your alt is fried, ive seen it happen tooo many times on way smaller amps, not to bash you man its just not possible or its got to be a anomoli or somethun.

dblsg · Post by **dblsg** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:30 pm

white2000neon wrote:my cardomain its on the www at the bottom of my posts, but the pics i have arent the greatest of it.

very nice set-up i must say... i imagine you have the subs hooked up to the 1800 watt amp and your 800 watt to the door and read deck speakers...

how many channels are on that 1800 if you don't mind me asking?

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 11:17 pm

dblsg wrote:
white2000neon wrote:my cardomain its on the www at the bottom of my posts, but the pics i have arent the greatest of it.
very nice set-up i must say... i imagine you have the subs hooked up to the 1800 watt amp and your 800 watt to the door and read deck speakers...

how many channels are on that 1800 if you don't mind me asking?

Yep big amp is for the subs and the little one for the inside speakers. The 1800w amp is only a one channel amp. I pieced that system together myself and installed it myself. Thanks for the compliment.

Yellowsxt23 you might be right, but all i know is that it sounds really good and when i turn the bass up it hits very nicely and very precise.

Mr Josh Zombie · Post by **Mr Josh Zombie** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 11:32 pm

Ya know... I just did the Big 3 this weekend in 1/0 AWG, same for the run to the amp... improved my grounds... and STILL my god damn headlights dim.

I'm only running MAYBE 250rms, about 600+ L.E.D.s, 4 neons, and the usual.

Needles to same, the $175 I had in wire, and wire-related parts did NOT make me happy with the outcome. Maybe I have a short somewhere...

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 11:44 pm

Are the connection on tight and did you upgrade all of the ground wires?

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 11:48 pm

you dont have a short its just simple physics if you cn only produce say 120 amps the nyou can only take 120, when you install neons, leds, amps, etc it take from other oe componets like headlights, it also takes from something a little more important the ingnition, but you cant see that like your headlights, best bet is to start with a good battry, optima etc. then get a good oversized cap maybe 5 farads, then see what you got, summit sells a dual battery hookup kit, could buy it then install a battery in the trunk or both in the trunk, i think a bigger or extra alt. would be one of my last componets to replace inless i was designing a really high end system. oh and i am sure your system sounds great bro, i never meant to say or seem like i was saying it wouldnt, i see in the pics what looks like a capacitor, how big? this may be one of the reason you can draw a little more amperage as a cap stores small amounts of energy for the amp.

Mr Josh Zombie · Post by **Mr Josh Zombie** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 12:07 am

white2000neon wrote:Are the connection on tight and did you upgrade all of the ground wires?

Yep, scrapped off the paint where my ground connections were, tightend them so they wouldnt move.

I did both engine grounds on the passanger side, the battery to chassis, battery to engine, new wire running from my altinator to my battry, 8g wire running to a distrobution block for all my accesory items (neons, led, ipod charger), 1/0 awg running to my amp and 1/0 awg ground for my amp to bare metal.

yellowsxt23 wrote:best bet is to start with a good battry, optima etc. then get a good oversized cap maybe 5 farads, then see what you got, summit sells a dual battery hookup kit, could buy it then install a battery in the trunk or both in the trunk, i think a bigger or extra alt. would be one of my last componets to replace inless i was designing a really high end system. oh and i am sure your system sounds great bro, i never meant to say or seem like i was saying it wouldnt, i see in the pics what looks like a capacitor, how big? this may be one of the reason you can draw a little more amperage as a cap stores small amounts of energy for the amp.

In terms of getting a cap, I've read all sorts of research on them, and I'm one of the "they're useless" crew. If they work for you, then great, but me, personally, I find no use for them.

Honestly, I don't know what pictures you seen where I might have a cap at. Just out of curiousty, what pictures are you talking about?

My next step would be a Optima yellowtop. Might get a bigger altinator later on down the road, but that will be a HUGE pain in the ass to change... and I don't wanna screw with it.

Oh, and my lights would/still do dim when I use my power windows. I always found that odd.... I can hear my engine bog down when I roll my window down... at least at idle.

yellowsxt23 · Post by **yellowsxt23** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 12:16 am

window motors draw alot of current when being used, i think like 25 amps per window, i was referring to white2000neons pics, as far as caps they only work fora few sec then they are drained they charge and discharge very quickly, depends on how you listen to your system, if ur rockin hard all the time then they will be of no use, but if you just rank it occasionally to pis of the old people next to you it wil work, an extra batt. and batt issolator is by far a better investment, can usually be done for under 200 bucks total. also make sure that you run a good grn for ur batt. its as inportant if not more important than the power wire to the alt. thing is a 12v car charging sytem is at the point of extinction, car manufactutes will be converting to 24v in the next 10 years due to all the electronics that are in cars these days. just like the yester year when they converted from 6v to 12v it was the same thing.

dblsg · Post by **dblsg** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 1:43 am

Opi wrote:In terms of getting a cap, I've read all sorts of research on them, and I'm one of the "they're useless" crew. If they work for you, then great, but me, personally, I find no use for them.

reading is fundamental, but being it a topic with such debate, i wouldn't knock it 'till i tried it. kinda like the whole NGC thing... get my drift?

white2000neon · Post by **white2000neon** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 12:23 pm

My cap is a 2 farad cap and seems to work great since i dont listen to music where the bass is constant i listen to music where it will one every few seconds. A cap will discharge in a few seconds but it will also charge in a few seconds.

esteinmaier · Post by **esteinmaier** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:37 pm

The usefulness of a cap depends on the amp that's drawing power from it. Better amps generally have better power transformers, and they act like a cap but matched to the rest of the transformer. For example, an "e" series JL Audio amp benefits from a cap where a "Slash" series amp does not.

I have a good amp in my car and a cap. The cap didn't do anything, but the digital voltmeter looks cool and I couldn't bring myself to remove it after all the effort to make it mount up solid.