MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Do you have a project going or will you be starting a project here very soon and just want to keep a log of everything you and when? Share with everyone every step of the way what sort of progress you are making on your project.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by theColonel » Wed Sep 18, 2019 12:00 pm

occasional demons wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:35 am
I mean if you have to spend around $100 to repair it, may as well put it towards a new un cracked manifold.

A heli coil and a stud might be more durable, since the stud would stay put as long as the nut was kept lubed. But if a stud prevents assembly due to clearance issues, then that option is out.

:withstupid: Your SRT-4 is well worth spending the money for a new exhaust manifold.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:18 pm

Right on, yeah just going to get a new one. Going with AGP.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by JeremyJ » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:52 pm

Will going to a different brand of manifold affect the alignment of anything, or are they pretty interchangeable?
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:41 pm

Yeah I was worried about that a bit... The 02 housing might be different but not sure. Need to ask the original owner. I believe the ATP manifold sits up higher or vice versa with the AGP. Let me look online. A AGP 02 housing is over $400 LOL

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Mon Sep 23, 2019 1:19 am

It has an ATP 02 housing. I have the reroute blocked off so it might work with the AGP manifold. Anyhow, I took the manifold off. Was not fun to do so. Found out my harbor freight 12mm crows foot was an 11mm! Even though it was labeled as a 12mm. So I went to Harbor Freight and got a new set free of charge since Pittsburg tools have a lifetime warranty.
Some of the studs came out, some stayed in. Going to buy a new Mopar Exhaust manifold gasket just because..Might as well since it is off. The part number for the Mopar SRT-4 exhaust manifold gasket is 4884447AA for reference.
05 PW1 SRT-4Not sure about buying new exhaust manifold studs or just re-using the ones on there?

Here are a couple pictures I took. As you can see the crack went through, this is a picture of inside the manifold:
Image I was having a weird issue with my car spiking lean at very random times, I might of mentioned that before. Well that could of been it with air entering the exhaust manifold.... So glad I took it off.

Here is a picture of the exhaust side of the head with the couple of exhaust studs they stayed in there.
Image No oil inside the exhaust ports. Was kind of worried about that. Tiny bit of black carbon but that could of been from the turbo blowing that journal bearing out.

So as of now waiting on the AGP exhaust manifold and their big turbo bolt kit. Ordered it through SDK last Thursday. Hopefully it gets shipped out this week.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by 04rebel » Mon Sep 23, 2019 6:47 am

I think you and Neon will be much happier with performance once all parts come in and are installed. Looks like good progress being made, I know that even with the SOHC 2.0 that I'm not thrilled about working on the firewall side of the motor! BUT I've had to work on worse applications than that in the past too. Hang in there and get it done right this occasion and then ENJOY running it! :)

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:58 pm

Should be able to re use the studs without any issues. Maybe loctite the ones that came out. I would use blue, even though they can still back out if the nuts stick. But if for some bizarre reason one should break, you can still remove it.

I use anti seize on all my studs outer ends. Using decent lock washers, or crimped lock nuts will keep them from possibly backing off. Once a little rust starts on the exposed stud threads, they will definitely stay put.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Fri Sep 27, 2019 4:34 pm

Right on will do. Got the AGP bolt set that came with 5 studs. Not sure why it came with 5 studs. Since there are 10 holes on the exhaust side of the head. I will get pictures with what I am dealing with. I just want to make sure I am doing it right.

I did some investigating. Mainly on the ATP exhaust manifold that was on there. Well long story short. It isn't a ATP log manifold. It was a cheap Kinetic manifold. So no wonder it cracked. Also found out the 02 housing is not a ATP unit, but a Kinetic unit. But that is actually in great shape. So really not sure why the original owner told me it was ATP. Lots of inconsistences.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Tue Oct 08, 2019 2:53 pm

Oh to answer my question above. There are only 5 studs due to just replacing the ones needed for a shorter stud for the AGP manifold.

More bad news. Had a buddy come over that works at a shop. He brought his big vice grips over and got two exhaust studs out that I could not get out. So that was good, super happy! But then I started to install my new AGP log manifold. Got all the nuts on finger tight, then started to torque them down from the inside out. Low and behold my dumbass forgot a stud on top. So as I was torquing the bottom center stud nuts I heard a "ding" didn't think much of it until I got back to the top and saw the EPIC fail. brand new Stud broke:
Image
So I will need a shop to weld a nut on it and back it out. :(

I took the new manifold off of course since that broke. And look what I found:
Image
Image
Glad I caught that! After heat cycles that could of broke off and ruined my turbo!

At this point need to get new exhaust studs similar to the ones in the AGP kit. Luckily I have the size dimensions. Car needs to go to a shop and have that stud extracted. If shop is willining I might just have them put my car all back together and spend the money at this point.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by JeremyJ » Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:17 pm

Oh man. This exhaust manifold situation is just more and more bad news. I hope someone can get it out for you for a reasonable price. Looks like a major pain in the ass.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:26 pm

There is not enough there to weld to.

It can be drilled in the center and an easy out could be attempted. The only issue is due to the size, the easy out will have to be relatively small. The risk is if the easy out snaps, there is no drilling that.

But a shop with a decent technician should be able to get it out. As long as the stud was not cranked into place/bottomed out, it should back out fairly easy. Sometimes they will even spin when drilling them.

And yeah, you'll want to get that casting flash cleaned up. At least most DOHC heads I have seen do not have any flash in the ports. The head on my '01 had so much that I could barely get my pinky finger through there. It gave the carbon a good surface to stick to...
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:48 pm

occasional demons wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:26 pm
There is not enough there to weld to.

It can be drilled in the center and an easy out could be attempted. The only issue is due to the size, the easy out will have to be relatively small. The risk is if the easy out snaps, there is no drilling that.

But a shop with a decent technician should be able to get it out. As long as the stud was not cranked into place/bottomed out, it should back out fairly easy. Sometimes they will even spin when drilling them.

And yeah, you'll want to get that casting flash cleaned up. At least most DOHC heads I have seen do not have any flash in the ports. The head on my '01 had so much that I could barely get my pinky finger through there. It gave the carbon a good surface to stick to...
You don't think so? I saw a mechanic on YouTube get it out on a Ram : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDlk7B-PRAA&t=936s 11:30 minutes in

Yeah I didn't have it in tight at all. Wow, that blows about your head on your 01. Wonder how much power is robbed on factory cars due to cast flash.
Oh man. This exhaust manifold situation is just more and more bad news. I hope someone can get it out for you for a reasonable price. Looks like a major pain in the ass.


That it has. It all deals with the manifold. If I could just get the manifold and then the turbo on there, everything else is cake. But its these little things that keep happening due to inexpierence on my part and not paying attention.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:25 pm

Hmmm, that might just work. I would be afraid of melting aluminum being that close, but I guess if you use a welder often enough, and know the proper heat settings...


If it was not bottomed out, it should come out pretty easy. Too bad you don't have a left hand drill bit handy, to see if it would catch it and spin it out. A regular drill bit would just move it in more. Which is fine if you are dealing with something that it can come out the other side. I have done plenty like that. But a blind hole, not so much.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:54 pm

good idea on the left hand drill bit... Its just so hard metal.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Thu Oct 10, 2019 8:57 pm

They are hard, but not undrillable hard. A good drill bit will cut right into a bolt or stud. The toughest part is getting it to start close to the center. But angling the bit around until it gets fairly well centered usually gets it close enough. Being in the place it is, it may be easier said than done.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Wed Oct 16, 2019 5:13 pm

I don't trust myself at this point attempting to do that.

Ziptied the rear seciton of the exhaust up and the 02 sensors so they don't hang. Car is back on the ground on all 4 wheels. Have a local muffler shop that said they "should" be able to get it out. So I need to find a tow truck to get it towed out of my garage to this shop. But I am waiting on my new exhaust studs to come in the mail. Going to ask to have that muffler shop just install the new AGP manifold while its there. Owner of the shop is not that easy to talk to. But he does very good work and has been welding probably longer then I have been alive.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by 04SRT4 » Wed Oct 16, 2019 6:42 pm

I like what you've done to the car man. The white is sharp and I like the detail on the motor work, painting the block, timing gears etc..Nice work!

I would soooo love to srt swap a 2dr coupe. Maybe one day
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:37 pm

Thanks man. I don't think the block or the "timing gears" has been painted. All original. The car only has right under 21k on it and doesn't see inclement weather.

Yeah a 1gn coupe with a srt-4 would be so much fun. There was a clean one for sale a month or so ago about 3 hours away from me. But the owner was shady. Would be fun, but I honestly wouldn't feel that safe in it compared to a 2gn

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:29 am

*Sigh* Good news and bad news.
Good news. The stud came right out. Image Guy at the muffler shop did a great job. We also installed my new AGP manifold. Only charged me $85+ tax. Now getting the car towed to the shop which was only about 3 miles from my house was a different story. $65 the first time. Then got another tow truck company to bring it back to my house soon after since all the other tow places were busy. $73 there.
Image Wasn't happy with the first tow truck guy. My front fascia was crunching right there. Luckily it didn't break a stud or anything in my fender. I should of removed my front fascia. He didn't know where to hook it up underneath either. 2nd tow truck was much better. Plus I borrowed 2x4's so it would go off easy.
Poor car :(
Image

Now the bad news. Got my turbo on and had to stop at the 02 housing. Since the Kinnetic manifold sits different on the car and the 02 housing is for the Kinnetic...it will not clear the AGP manifold.
Image
Image
So I was looking online for a used AGP big turbo 02 housing. One guy was selling an old style one. Looked super rough. Had some rusty looking areas I believe where it wouldn't hold up well and leak. Could get it for $200 shipped. Doesn't show the red/orange spot in the picture. I just don't trust it. Image

I decided I am going to buy a new AGP 02 housing. At this point might as well right?!? $405! I have a $50 credit through AGP due to the flash casking. So it will be around $380 shipped. Might offset the cost if I can sell my Kinnetic 02 housing which is perfect and manifold. Hopefully the last thing I need to get this car going. Going to have pretty much a brand new turbo setup on this car. Lots of money has been spent. But it is worth it for this car that I plan to keep. Just has been frustrating.

So just need to bolt up 02 housing, wastegate/dump tube. screw oil feed line on top and the rest is very easy after that. Start it up and let it idle for 20 minutes to break the new turbo in. Hopefully it doesn't blow white smoke LOL

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:39 am

That was a good idea putting that washer behind the nut. A little protection for the aluminum...
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by Midnight_Rider » Tue Oct 22, 2019 1:51 am

:shock: Tow truck! This is what I was thinking at Carlisle this year when my car broke down. Hope that the fascia survived okay.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:53 am

Yeah my front fascia is fine. This car is just really upsetting me. Its just one thing after the other and prolongs the process... Good news first: Got the new 02 housing on. Had to go to hardware store and get some smaller nuts due to the flange and how it goes on. This new $$$ 02 housing is super nice and a lot bigger then my previous one. Look at the comparison!
Image
Image
Oil feed line screwed on. Upstream 02 sensor on. Not sure why they positioned it where they did. Its like right where the alternator heatshield is. So I had to take that alternator heatshield off. Put the 02 sensor on and then put the shield on and bend around the sensor. So stupid. You can kind of see it in this picture:
Image
Also that picture has my current problem/headache...Notice the holes for the wastegate. They are perfect. The bolts are new. But for some reason the bolts do not want to thread in there nicely. They get tough after a turn. My old manifold wastegate holes the bolts go in super easy. Without mouting the wastegate, I just started to tighten it with a socket and it gets super tight after like 2 turns. Makes no sense.
You can see in this picture also another issue. No idea how the dump tube is going to mount to the WG. Going to have to grind stuff down to get it to fit. You can see how I have the WG bolts on that is far as I could tighten them. Maybe it is the type of metal or something? And You just have to work the bolt in? Ugh. That would be horrible to strip that hole out or break a bolt in that. Through having that happen.
Image

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:16 pm

Yeah, they could have clocked that o2 sensor bung a little lower down, and not hurt a thing. Obviously they mocked that up on an engine without the alternator installed, or it was an N/A alternator (Mocked on an N/A engine configuration). Hopefully the wires don't chafe on the heat shield.

Maybe check those waste gate screws. Possibly the holes are (just guessing) M6x1.00, and the screws are 1/4 - 24, or vice versa. It is very close, but not quite close enough to work.

M8 and 5/16 fine thread could be similar enough also.


A 12 point nut would almost be better suited to that flange being that tight. But you would have to source that from a real fastener place, instead of the local hardware.

Or they could have dimpled the housing just enough for clearance, but someone might complain that it would hurt flow.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Sat Oct 26, 2019 4:53 pm

Yeah turns out I had the right ones..I just had them mixed in. They look the exact same with the same markings. But they are ever so slightly longer and thinner. Ugh! So glad it was easy. Feel much better now.
Found this on SRTforums:
Studs for the Manifold to Head - (5) M8x1.25x40
Cast Manifold to Turbo - (4) 3/8-16x1
Cast Manifold to Wastegate - (2) 5/16-18x7/8
Turbine Housing to O2 housing - (4) M8x1.25x20

If you are going to source these parts from your local bolt supply house, make sure that all your standard bolts are Grade 8, and all your metric bolts are class 10.9.

For all the lock washers, they must be "HIGH ALLOY" or they will not keep their tension on the bolt head.
What kind of size is that? 5/16-18x7/8???

I have everything on except the rest of the exhaust and of course the wastegate dump tube. The 02 has a weird setup on the exhaust side with threaded holes. It came with studs too. So confused. Not sure if they were meant for the top portion to connect to the turbo or what. I need to charge my battery up since I have a small battery.
Before attempting to start the engine, crank the engine with the fuel/ignition shut off for ten to 15 seconds (three separate times) or until the instruments show an oil pressure buildup. Start the engine and allow running at idle speed for 15 to 20 minutes without accelerating or until engine has reached full operating temperature. Check for oil/water leaks around turbocharger and related installed components. After it has been determined that there are no leaks in the oiling system of the turbo, allow approximately 100 miles driven under normal conditions without going into “boost”. This is done to properly wash out all of the assembly lube used when assembling the turbocharger, and to allow carbon to build up along the piston ring areas of the turbine shaft. Immediately running the turbocharger to its full potential without proper break-in procedures will cause premature turbocharger failure. Additionally our manifold is cast thick, and is a shared runner plenum, so it generates and retains a lot of heat; more heat than long runner style manifolds. This allows for quicker spoolup, however it requires you to let the car cool down after driving it. We recommend letting the vehicle idle for 3 minutes before shutting it off under normal driving. After running the car hard, we recommend letting the vehicle idle for 6 minutes before shutting it off. This will help your turbocharger live a fruitful long life.
So I am going to pull the ASD fuse and the connector to the coil pack and crank it for 10 seconds or so once I get this battery fully charged.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:26 pm

5/16 -18 is the bolt size and thread pitch. 7/8 inch long. That's the odd part, because it would be tough to find a .875 length. all I have ever seen is in 1/4 inch increments, rarely are they in 1/8 inch increments.

Not sure why they didn't just make them all metric, and tossed one SAE bolt size in the mix.
Before attempting to start the engine, crank the engine with the fuel/ignition shut off for ten to 15 seconds (three separate times) or until the instruments show an oil pressure buildup.
If you really wanted to prime the oil, without killing the battery, pull the ASD relay and the spark plugs. The engine will crank faster, and take a lot less amps. Just a bit more work, pulling them, and then reinstalling them. But you will get it primed faster, and have more pressure.

IDK if they want a bit of air pushing the turbo vanes while it is priming or not, but I don't think it would matter, as long as there is plenty of oil there.
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:45 pm

Ahh gotcha on the bolt size, yeah that is very weird they did standard on some. I messaged AGP about that.

Hey Bill you say to pull the ASD fuse. Does that disable to ignition and fuel pump? I pulled the fuel pump relay (31) and just pulled the connector to the coil pack. I cranked the car for about 10 seconds or so. Did it again and the oil light went away some I guess it got oil pressure. I didn't look underneath the car at this point. I put the relay back in and connected the coil pack and she started right up! WAS so happy. Until I looked underneath the car. About a half a qt of oil was spewing all over the ground! So I shut it off real quick and threw some universal absorbent on the nice sized puddle it left. Only thing that came to mind was the oil feed line from the block to turbo. And of course after I cleaned it up it was leaking from that line. Brand new line too. Of course user install error I suppose on my half. Not leaking from the NPT into the block, but the screw in area to the 90 degree bend...Not sure it kind of looked like it was seeping out of the gap where the 90 degree is crimped to the fitting but not 100% sure. Super hard to get to since everything is connected but I got a 14mm stubby up in there and I believe it was loose... So I tightened it up and I cranked the car over. Wasn't sure how much PSI that generates. Online says around 40 psi or so but that is after cranking it for a while. Didn't look like it was leaking. So I guess I got to put a bucket under there and start it up and see if it is still leaking. Really hope that line didn't get damaged or the crimp got loose when I was moving it around doing the manifold install. Just don't want to run the car long if it is still leaking since the turbo won't be getting little to any oil.

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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:54 pm

Yeah, the ASD relay or fuse will keep power from the fuel injectors and the coil.

It could still inject fuel if there is residual pressure just by pulling the FP relay.

Hopefully the oil leak is fixed!
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Wed Oct 30, 2019 4:28 pm

Ahhh interesting I didn't know that about just pulling the FP relay how it could inject fuel if there is still pressure in the system. So technically I can just pull that little yellow 20 amp ASD fuse and leave the coil pack connected?

Got the car running yesterday. Looks like the oil leak is fixed for the most part. Nothing was dripping, I see a little dab of oil where the 90 degree bend is though :( Will have to wipe it down an keep and eye on it. Got the car up to temp too and didn't start blowing white smoke :) :). That would of been a huge bummer! It was smoking a little bit for a while. Due to having a new exhaust manifold gasket and the seal setting in the turbo. Video:
https://i.imgur.com/mcSs580.mp4
There is the 90 degree fitting you can see it between hardline loop on the PS rack.

So now I need to turn the downpipe since I bolted it down wrong 90 degrees. My fault not paying attention. :( Get wideband o2 back in there and dummy o2 which is not active since no CAT. Ziptie the oil feed line so it doesn't hit the o2 housing or the manifold. Get the battery back in there secure and mounted properly. Intake. Ziptie the chargepipe up since the new manifold sits lower my chargepipe won't bolt on the oil pan/transmission like before. No biggy really. No one looks under there. Get PS steering reservoir back in place. Have a new PCV line I need to cut down and route with my oil catch can. After that it should be good to cruise in. Need to keep revs down for 100 miles according to AGP to break everything in. I can't go WOT anyways... No dumptube at this point. One I had on there of course..won't fit. I am not sure how I can get one mounted in there with such little space with that bigger o2 housing!!
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Another angle:
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08 Acura TL-S
05 Neon SRT-4

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MyNeonSaysHi
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Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by MyNeonSaysHi » Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:42 pm

I was wrong I put the dumptube up on there and it looks like it will fit. But getting a bolt in that hole towards the o2 elbow is going to be tough. Well mess with it more this weekend. 65 degrees and sunny today! But its going to get cold real quick tonight.

Drove the car around town, put about 20 miles on it so far with the new turbo yesterday. Got it all nice and clean today after sitting in the garage for months.
I bought a set of ACR wheels and tires last month. Very crappy crappy tires. They are like $50 new or something. 215/55/16. They are new so that is a plus I guess. I plan on swapping them out though. I took the Enkei's off because they have a summer compound which doesn't like cold weather, they get hard. I don't really plan on driving the car hard so the ACR wheels went on.

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When I swapped out the wheels I noticed on my passenger rear BC coilover bottom lock collor was like screwed up and there was oil around the threads. :( So I tightened it back down. No idea how that happened, must of popped loose or something.

Pretty sure it is leaking/seeping at that 90 degree bend. :( Such a hard place to get to. So if its not leaking at the block or the nut to tighten it own, does that mean the fitting is bad? I messaged AGP since its a brand new oil feed line.
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Going to drive the car to work today to put some miles on it. I don't see it actively dripping when the car is running. Just like a quarter size puddle sitting in the garage over night.

08 Acura TL-S
05 Neon SRT-4

occasional demons
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Location: Ashland Ohio

Re: MyNeonSaysHi Mod Log: Stone White

Post by occasional demons » Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:04 am

I didn't know 215/55/16's would fit on a neon. I guess Coilovers help with that. :D

That's what I run on the Impreza for winter. I just had a non studded set of these delivered yesterday:

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The tread looks deeper in person. Just need to get them mounted.


That sucks about the oil leak though. At least it is not a major leak, but I'm sure it is still annoying.
Bill
dblsg wrote:ya'll a bunch of post whores
Seriously people, this is 2019 not 1920.
2001 Neon ES MTX with '02 R/T PCM
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