Need a FEW quick answer...

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 8:04 pm

will the NGC screw around with me if i install an adjustable cam gear and slightly advance the timing? also does anybody know the degrees to advance before knock occures? i don't really wanna go through the process of figuring that out.

*EDIT: also when i changed back to stock wheels for the winter (expecting 8" of snow by tomorrow night) i noticed it's almost timefor new pads. so i was wanting to kill 2 birds with 1 stone and do an srt or an r/t rear disk swap and throw on some performance rotors front and rear. the questions i have here:

should i do srt or r/t? i read in a lot of spots that they're the same except for rotor thickness. so i'm thinkin that it doesn't really matter there.

sense the srt and r/t are both ABS equiped cars will it brake funny?

does anybody know if anybody has any that they wanna get rid of?

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 2:07 am

over 20 people look and nobody can answer even one? come on guys i know you guys are smarter than me

Wenuden · Post by **Wenuden** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 7:44 am

you're right about the thickness thing. R/t would probably be cheaper. As for the abs, it won't matter since your car doesn't have it.

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 8:56 am

will the NGC screw around with me if i install an adjustable cam gear and slightly advance the timing? also does anybody know the degrees to advance before knock occures? i don't really wanna go through the process of figuring that out.

All the hype about NGC, the NGC controller is desgined to keep your A/F ratio's as close to STOICH as possible. Wich means you add more air flow, reset the pcm and let it relearn the new setup and it will still keep the engine running STOICH. The NGC controller does not restrict you from making power.
Messing with the cam like your talking about doing is NOT recomended. All your going to do is create problems. The cam is designed to operate straight up and not altered.
Also have you ever look at the specs between the 02 and 03 2.0 motor?
Youll notice that with the introduction of NGC they are able to make the same power as the 00-02 motor but with less compression and different programming.

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 11:40 am

so what are you saying? is there pretty much instantly knock?

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 6:35 pm

another question...

has anybody heard anything about HID kits like this that you aim the beams on low to not blind people and then when you hit the highs it adjusts the beam upwards to shoot the light farther.

http://www.americanmuscle.com/hid-dual- ... -9007.html

Post by **occasional demons** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 7:02 pm

Cam timing and spark knock are not related. (If that's what you meant). My understanding of the NGC is that the PCM will set a CEL if the cam timing is off more than a few degrees, unlike the older PCM"s, that only set a CEL if the belt skips one tooth. The spark timing is not adjustable. Unless a separate controller is used. Not sure if that's what you were looking for, but the way you typed it, it appears that way.

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 7:05 pm

well i got an adjustable cam gear and i'm gonna be puttin it on my new head with a crane 12 and i'm wondering if i should advance the timing at all

BlackRoseRacing · Post by **BlackRoseRacing** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:20 am

no, install it straight up...
Messing with the cam timing is going to trigger a Cam/Crank out of sinc signal....
Also messing with the cam timing to much could throw a valve into the piston. The advantage of using an adjustable cam gear is so you have the flexability of degee'ng the cam to specs wich not many people really do.

Post by **occasional demons** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:08 am

BlackRoseRacing wrote:no, install it straight up...
Messing with the cam timing is going to trigger a Cam/Crank out of sinc signal....
Also messing with the cam timing to much could throw a valve into the piston. The advantage of using an adjustable cam gear is so you have the flexability of degee'ng the cam to specs wich not many people really do.

And it could be used to get the cam "straight up" if the head has been milled. I forget the numbers, but the Dodge Raider FSM gave a formula for it. I think it was something like: For every .008" milled from the head it retards the cam timing 1 degree.
Don't know if it holds exactly true for our engines, but it will change any OHC engine, as the centerlines between the cam and crank move closer when the head is milled. Just something to consider if you mill .040" from your head. If I remembered those numbers correctly that would move the cam 5*

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:19 am

well my cam gear that i got says anything more than .005" it should be adjusted. i also read that you should adjust an aftermarket cam because thay're not the same in timing.

also anybody got anything on this question?

Hudson_Neon wrote:another question...

has anybody heard anything about HID kits like this that you aim the beams on low to not blind people and then when you hit the highs it adjusts the beam upwards to shoot the light farther.

http://www.americanmuscle.com/hid-dual- ... -9007.html

2001Neon_LX · Post by **2001Neon_LX** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:16 pm

I have a Bi-Xenon HID kit in my neon , 9007 bulb and when you flip your hignbeams on the bulb points down towards the ground slightly and is suppose to throw the light further. Lol well i have noticed that it dosen't throw light as far down the road as having the lowbeams on, so when I meet a car with my lowbeams on I flip my highbeams so i don't blind the person. Never had anybody flash me either.

Hudson_Neon · Post by **Hudson_Neon** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:26 pm

but the motor idea is good?

Post by **occasional demons** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 9:29 pm

If you want to get the most out of your cam and gear...
http://www.wheelsjamaica.com/wheels_for ... msg1122806
Granted it's not a neon motor but I couldn't get one in a search, but you get the idea. what you have to ask is it worth buying all the tools to get the cam "perfect" ? At the most you'll prolly only gain 1 hp and have spent around $100 and attempting it with the motor in the car wouldn't be pleasant either. My recommendation would be install the gear since you've got it anyway and experiment with it. move it a few degrees either way and see where you like it at best. Keep in mind though it may take a while for the PCM to adjust to the new cam and it's position. When I installed the '02 Magnum cam in mine it took almost 700 miles before it got used to the idea. I was cosidering a cam gear to adjust it because it made less power than the SE cam at first. To be honest I was just a bit concerned. The only other thing I did was clean the nasty casting flash/cabon buidup from the exhaust ports. Basically my advise is if it doesn't run like you expected give it some time. Hopefully yours isn't a slow learner like mine. I would set it @ 0* and let it learn then play with it. Just don't get too far out, Idon't think you will hit the pistons but why chance it? Besides your NGC will set a code if you get it off too much anyway. The timing should be the same as the factory cam because of this. They aren't going to sell stuff that takes an expert mechanic to install as far as getting the sensors to work properly. If that was the case they wouldn't move much product. On old school motors you could adjust the distributor to compensate. Until someone makes an adjustable cam sensor... not that it controls spark timing (injector timing) but that's the only example I could think of. Fuel timing wasn't a factor then!