Positive camber problem

excon · Post by **excon** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:27 pm

Let me first say that I recently did the drum to disc swap on the back. After that was done, I noticed I had some BAD positive camber problems on the rear. I took it to goodyear to have my tires rotated and to get an alignment. It turns out that I have a positive camber of 3.4 and -1.1 on the back. They tried putting in cam bolts but even putting in 2 didn't work. I asked the sales manager (who has a first generation neon nicely tuned and bored out .30 over... yeah) what i could do about it, and he said i could get camber plates for it.

Where would I find those? Also, any other suggestions?

NiteHawk · Post by **NiteHawk** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:38 pm

what all did you swap over when you did your brake swap

if the camber is out 3.4degrees, then there's something wrong there......

excon · Post by **excon** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:51 pm

the backing plate assembly, hub, rotors, calipers, etc.

...think about it... the donor srt-4 was in a wreck.

Anyone got any ideas? I checked modernperformance and the only thing they have is adjustable camber plates for the BC coilovers... I have a stock suspension...

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 2:16 pm

was the positive on the rear still or on the front? I had issues with positive camber on the front and resorted to doing some grinding of the knuckle and slotting of the strut. After that I was able to get a neutral alignment.

You can see that in my progress log, linked in my sig.

excon · Post by **excon** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 2:21 pm

Thanks, at least I'll be able to see what you did. I thought there was a kit that went on top of the strut tower that would allow you to adjust the camber.

the positive camber is on the rear driver's side, and the negative 1.1 is on the passenger.

LionheartedSXT · Post by **LionheartedSXT** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 2:50 pm

So is this a common problem with camber when doing a srt rear brake swap? I already have some suspension work done plus the installation of camber bolts already and a good alignment, will doing this swap force me to have to get a new alignment?

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 3:42 pm

any time you take your struts off from the knuckles you need an alignment. So doing the brake swap will cause you to need an alignment.

As for this particular situation, I think the one knuckle might be bad. Both my rears came out fine with the negative 1.0 caber easily. I seem to be the only one to have any problems with the front giving me (mind you evenly) a +4 degree camber. As such I took some drastic measure to correct it by shaving the knuckle and slotting the strut. I do not know of anyone else who has had to do this. I also do not know if it has anything to do with how much a drop I have with my strut/spring combonation or what...

So, like I said, I suspect the one knuckle is no good.

excon · Post by **excon** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 10:44 pm

i KNOW the knuckle is no good! Every camber bolt kit says it only adjusts it 1 - 1.75 degrees. still... at 2.5 degrees i'm +.9 degrees. I think i'm going to have to take it to a frame shop and have them correct it for me... this sucks

...but wait... if i got an adjustable coilover suspension... would i be able to adjust the camber 3.4 degrees???

LionheartedSXT · Post by **LionheartedSXT** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 1:55 pm

hansken_yo wrote:any time you take your struts off from the knuckles you need an alignment. So doing the brake swap will cause you to need an alignment.

As for this particular situation, I think the one knuckle might be bad. Both my rears came out fine with the negative 1.0 caber easily. I seem to be the only one to have any problems with the front giving me (mind you evenly) a +4 degree camber. As such I took some drastic measure to correct it by shaving the knuckle and slotting the strut. I do not know of anyone else who has had to do this. I also do not know if it has anything to do with how much a drop I have with my strut/spring combonation or what...

So, like I said, I suspect the one knuckle is no good.

Just trying to make sure I'm understanding you. So even with the eibach camber correction kit installed and adjusted already in my car, if and when i remove my rear brake assembly to swap it for discs, i still need to get an alignment correct?

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:16 pm

You shouldnt have any positive camber on the rear if everything was done correctly since we use the same rear knuckle set-up.

and Hansken_yo I feel ur pain on the positive camber issue after the srt front brake swap. I have positive 4 on one side and 3 on the other. but ive been doing research and I figured alot out. I think once im done with my swap I'll solve that problem without having to take the drastice measures you did.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Sun Aug 10, 2008 1:24 pm

LionheartedSXT wrote: Just trying to make sure I'm understanding you. So even with the eibach camber correction kit installed and adjusted already in my car, if and when i remove my rear brake assembly to swap it for discs, i still need to get an alignment correct?

Yeah. Anytime you take your suspension apart you will change the configuration of your alignment. You may be able to get it close to a good setup without going to a shop, but it is unlikely, and even more so with a bad knuckle.

LionheartedSXT · Post by **LionheartedSXT** » Sun Aug 10, 2008 2:14 pm

well damn, thats changing my mind now, I just recently got a alignment over spring break after putting in my struts and cambers...I don't feel i'm need of another one anytime soon...so I guess the rear brakes will have to wait...

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:44 pm

lol.... i know what you mean... I've had 3 this year alone, only because I keep working on my suspension.

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Sun Aug 10, 2008 7:54 pm

Honestly you dont have to everytime only if u lower the car u really need to. Unless u mess around with the front tie rod end (loosen the lock nut) or if u turn the rear control bolt the u would need one. I have messed with mine alot and since im in shop classes i check mine after im done and im alwayz in spec. Unless u beat the snot out of something with a hammer u should be ok.

excon · Post by **excon** » Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:33 pm

LionheartedSXT wrote:well damn, thats changing my mind now, I just recently got a alignment over spring break after putting in my struts and cambers...I don't feel i'm need of another one anytime soon...so I guess the rear brakes will have to wait...

GOOD! I would not suggest ANYONE do the swap unless they know where the brakes came from. Do not buy these things off ebay people. I did, since there are only 2 SRT-4s in my town, and no r/t's in the junkyard. I was sold a pair of brakes from an srt-4 that was obviously hit on the rear drivers side and completely totaled. I'm feeling very sick now since I have to take it to a body shop.

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 11:05 pm

excon wrote:
LionheartedSXT wrote:well damn, thats changing my mind now, I just recently got a alignment over spring break after putting in my struts and cambers...I don't feel i'm need of another one anytime soon...so I guess the rear brakes will have to wait...

GOOD! I would not suggest ANYONE do the swap unless they know where the brakes came from. Do not buy these things off ebay people. I did, since there are only 2 SRT-4s in my town, and no r/t's in the junkyard. I was sold a pair of brakes from an srt-4 that was obviously hit on the rear drivers side and completely totaled. I'm feeling very sick now since I have to take it to a body shop.

I cant think of any real reason for that if u use ur rear knuckle u shouldnt have any issues. taking it to a body shop is a waste of ur money. try fixing it urself with ur knuckles and see if they work then.

Post by **occasional demons** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:28 am

If the rear knuckle is bent, then you're pretty much screwed. I don't think any reputable shop will attempt to straighten a damaged suspension part; for liability reasons. You didn't get the knuckles from a certain ebay store in Texas did you?, if so I'll garantee they're bad. They tried to blame a bent crossmember on shipping. A 20 ton porta power wouldn't straighten it. I'd like to see the cliff that Fed ex dropped it from to damage it. Try to get some $ back out of them.
You may end up biting the bullet and buying a new one. Life's little lessons suck ass.

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:55 am

all u need for the srt rear disc is the backing plate u can use ur knuckle that holds ur drum brakes its the same. if u know urs aint bent use it and u dont have to go through all the trouble of removing ur tesion rod or struts.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:21 am

It sucks, but you'll most likely have to eat the one knuckle and find one that isn't Fubar.

excon · Post by **excon** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:13 pm

Turns out, the spindle IS bent. Sucks, but I can use my stock spindles! I just have to disassemble the drum assembly and put the srt hub and bearing on. WHEW! This was going to get expensive!

p.s. hansken... yo.... um not the backing plate... spindle...

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:19 pm

I was refering to thttxboy's comment about the knuckles in regards to being able to use the one that had the drum brake on it for the disc brake...

Anyway, you can use the spindles, press out the old, press in the new with new bearings!!!

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:28 pm

the bracket for the calipers is on the backing plate ill get pics up of the ones i got in my room. have any of u all even tried to take it apart? I've done the swap on 3 different cars and i have never removed the knuckle.

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:15 pm

Ok here are the pics

firts pic the front u can see the 4 holes for the knuckle in the middle same as ours, if u remove ur drum u will see these bolts that go there. the caliper bracket and backing plate and e brake system are all 1

ok so heres the pic of the rear it shows where the knuckle attaches to the bracket. the hole next to the spindle hole is for the ABS sensor if u choose to use it.

so just so u guys know u can use ur knuckle even if u had drums on before. this way makes instalition alot easier and u dont have to remove any on the suspention at all. I learned quickly that the control arm bolts that attach to the knuckle or the tension rod bolt dont alwayz what to come off easily especially if thier rusted on good. instalition takes like 1 1/2 to 2hours for me and has alwayz worked fine.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:08 am

^ Nice yo... I couldn't remember if that was actually part of the knuckle or separate. Thanks for straightening that out

LionheartedSXT · Post by **LionheartedSXT** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:06 pm

So just to clarify, there won't be any need for an alignment with using the srt-4 backing plates and your stock drum knuckle?

excon · Post by **excon** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:53 pm

LionheartedSXT wrote:So just to clarify, there won't be any need for an alignment with using the srt-4 backing plates and your stock drum knuckle?

...you've asked that question three times.
ANSWER: you need an alignment after doing the swap.

if the back wheels are out of alignment somehow, your wheel will be pointing straight, but your back wheels will be doing something funky. Therefore, you will not be driving in a straight line.

thttxboy · Post by **thttxboy** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:05 am

excon wrote:
LionheartedSXT wrote:So just to clarify, there won't be any need for an alignment with using the srt-4 backing plates and your stock drum knuckle?
...you've asked that question three times.
ANSWER: you need an alignment after doing the swap.

if the back wheels are out of alignment somehow, your wheel will be pointing straight, but your back wheels will be doing something funky. Therefore, you will not be driving in a straight line.

actually u wouldnt need an alignment if all u did was remove the drum brakes and put on the disc without removing anything else. If u remove ur strut and u have camber bolts then yes U will need an alignment or if u turn the rear toe adjuster bolt (on the inner bolt of the control arm not on the knuckle) then yes u would also need it. but it is possible to do the rear disc swap by only removing ur drum brakes from the knuckle and putting the rear disc on and so then nothing that would affect ur alignment would be touched.

LionheartedSXT · Post by **LionheartedSXT** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:00 pm

excon wrote: ...you've asked that question three times.
ANSWER: you need an alignment after doing the swap.

if the back wheels are out of alignment somehow, your wheel will be pointing straight, but your back wheels will be doing something funky. Therefore, you will not be driving in a straight line.

Actually the second time was just verification, and if you were paying attention this last question was actually different, I know you need an alignment if you remove the knuckle from the strut, but this time I was asking if you just take off the drum and leave the stock knuckle and just swap in the rear disc if an alignment would still be necessary, and now I see that it is not, thank you thttxboy...