Need Advice ASAP Super SssLLLOOOwww Acceleration

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 12:19 pm

Hi Folks,
I'm a new owner of a 98 Dodge Neon Sport with 230,000 K's on it. I'm in Ontario Canada and with all used car buys U have to have it e-tested & a safety done. No real prob with the safety other than a wheel bearing and changing the clouded headlights as well as a few other minor things. As for the e-test it failed because of excess gas in exhaust at 1850 rpm. When I bought it we were not able to get it to start because it had sat for a year and the alternator was siezed. When I finally got it to run without the alternator it seemed really slow on acceleration & had no real get up & go so I fig not enough power WRONG. Had the alt replaced & still no get up & go even with the pedal to the floor in the kick down area. I took it out to the highway & put er to the floor again & was able to get it up to 100 K (60 mph US) the most it reved was 2800 rpm downhill. The puzzling thing is it runs really smooth no chuging or bucking & it starts nice & easy in -15 c. In park I can get it to rev to 4000 rpm no prob no misses or farts. I'm not to concerned about the giddy up go would be nice to have some more but I really need to get a pass on the e-test. No codes yet as I'm waiting on my mecanic for them, but in the mean time I really need some advice ASAP before I put much more $$$ into my Neon any help Would be apreciated.

Regards,
PosterGrampa

Post by **occasional demons** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 12:31 pm

Welcome!

Possibly the Cat. converter or a mega mouse hotel in the muffler.
Usually that's how a car will act with a good amount of exhaust restriction. The o2 sensor could be bad, causing the cat converter to go out. Was there a Check Engine Light? (CEL)
IIRC you can't pull codes on a '97-'99 Chrysler product with out a code scanner. Those three years FTL!
I'm mainly posting that tidbit so other ppl here don't ask why you didn't getr the codes by doing the key on 3 times. It won't help.
I have a '99 cherokee and you have to take it to Autozone or buy a code reader.

GreeNeons03 · Post by **GreeNeons03** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 12:50 pm

I thought I read that the first gen Neons did the "turn key three times" thing aswell. Doesn't the CEL just flash a number of times to give the code?

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:05 pm

Thanks "occasional demons" & GreeNeons03 I was kinda thinking it was the cat & or a mouse. As for check engine light I haven't seen that yet or I haven't noticed it yet. Will def check the cat & mouse to see if that is the cause & look for CE.

Regards,

PG

GreeNeons03 · Post by **GreeNeons03** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:13 pm

Cat, mouse

Anyway, jokes aside, I think what he means by the mouse thing is that there may be some rodents that have turned your muffler into their home.

Post by **occasional demons** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:41 pm

GreeNeons03 wrote:I thought I read that the first gen Neons did the "turn key three times" thing aswell. Doesn't the CEL just flash a number of times to give the code?

OBDI would flash the CEL. Early OBDII's didn't. OBDII started in 1996/1997. I know that Jeeps and Dodge Rams don't give any codes, so I'm just assuming since they all use the same basic PCM, none do. If any of you '97-'99 1gn owners want to confirm this please do.

Edit: If you can get the muffler to come loose without destroying it, that would be a way to eliminate, or confirm it is plugged. Just run it with it tied off to the side of the pipe. Plus if the cat is bad, there shouldn't be much noise comming out the open pipe.

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:17 pm

Well no mouse hotel but the cat was sick. LOL so was the o2 sensor replaced both. Car goes back for a re-test 2pm tommorow so I will let U folks know how I make out. Hope it passes as the wife is just in love

with it

if not this will be me in her books

so everbody keep Ur fingers crossed

Donkeypuncher · Post by **Donkeypuncher** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:59 pm

If the car sat for a long time with gas in the tank, it may have clogged up the fuel filter.

You can diagnose the cat. converter the same way as the muffler. Just unbolt the exhaust before the cat and go for a drive, if the power comes back then you found your problem.

That's all I can think of right now.

excon · Post by **excon** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:22 pm

If it sat for a while you could also have sludge in your oil pan... since the clogged catalytic converter took away from your power, try taking the muffler off and going for a ride. Those mufflers have been known to be a bit restrictive...

or wait, the '98 sport... does that have two pipes coming out of the single muffler? if so I believe it flows better...

I think you typed the address wrong... don't you want the experts on 1gn.org?

Post by **occasional demons** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:18 pm

excon wrote::I think you typed the address wrong... don't you want the experts on 1gn.org?

Hey!

Don't be sending the noobies over there, we need all the souls we can collect here on the Dark Side!

I'm sure you may find more relevant info at 1gn, and the other .org. But we're more fun!

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:22 pm

Hell I'm such a Newbie I don't know a G1 from a G2 what's the years on these rice burners? that is the way to tell a G1 from a G2 the year it was made right?

patton98 · Post by **patton98** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:35 pm

NOW WAIT A MINUTE......not all of the cars here are rice burners.....first generation neons are from 95-99 and second gen is 00 and up, but they did change the bodies a little bit in 03 and up, and then you have the SRT's....better watch what you say.....

GreeNeons03 · Post by **GreeNeons03** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:37 pm

Rice burners? Are you sure you don't have one of these:

Anyway.

The first generation Neons were produced between 1995 and 1999

The second generation Neons were produced between 2000 and 2005

(Damn, TMFS!)

Post by **occasional demons** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:48 pm

Got you young un's fired up, eh?

GreeNeons03 wrote:

Now, you would have to admit if that thing was functional it would scare the shit out of most ppl! I could use some flamethrowers like that for those annoying tailgaiters. If you can't dust 'em, fry the bastids!

Donkeypuncher · Post by **Donkeypuncher** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:15 am

occasional demons wrote: If you can't dust 'em, fry the bastids!

That's what brakes are for, make them kiss your ass, figuratively and literally.

GreeNeons03 · Post by **GreeNeons03** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:13 am

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:48 am

How many Honda's & Mustangs U gota feed that thing to get it to run. I think U have to be a 007 agent to drive smthn like that or just plain crazy..... What tailgaiters I think that thing ate a jet or smthn big cause thats one scary lookin rear end

Also thanks for the info on how to tell a G1 from a G2 & as long as nobody objects I will stick around here for a bit for some advice

GreeNeons03 · Post by **GreeNeons03** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:54 am

That's cool, I think we have a couple of people with a first gen here and some people with both a first and second gen.

patton98 · Post by **patton98** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:28 am

I have a 2002 r/t and a 98 Expresso....i live on both the .org's....and i get great advice and tips from both.....to be completely honest i think id be screwed if i hadn't talked to the people on here

Post by **occasional demons** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:03 pm

We are more of a community, than who has what. Even if you don't own a neon/dodge you are welcome, as long as you're not a tool/troll.

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:17 pm

It Passed with flying colors.... Wife is

I'm

now just a few small issues getting fixed today & the wife will be driving it tommorow

Thanks to all of U who had some helpful idea's & hints

Now that I own a Neon I more than likely be back lookin for some more help.

Just a note here if any1 else has really slow acceleration look at your kick down it maybe stuck or out of ajustment. My mecanic drove it over for the e-test & he noticed it wasn't working so it was trying to go faster in 3rd gear & not dropping into 2nd for a burst of power like it should, he said we should feel the difference when we drive it now.

Adionik · Post by **Adionik** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:56 pm

Make sure you change that transmission fluid if it's been sitting there a year and you're romping on it for the 4 bangers anemic power....

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 7:01 pm

Tranny fluid change is a given whenever I buy a used car for all I know it could be the original stuff. I toasted a tranny because of old fluid. 1st thing the tranny guy said did I flush it & change the fluid when U bought it? A $850.00 mistake back in the 70's when I was makin $5.25 an hr

Needless to say everything I buy or own gets it's fluids changed right away & regularly

saves $$$ in the long run also helps for resale later.

Here is a hint for U do it Urself guys, if you have an old computer hard drive kickin around. Tear it apart for the 2 really strong magnets in it. Put them on the deepest parts of your oil pan & tranny & if they are alum epoxy them on. That will keep most of steel particals from floating around in there causing extra wear & tear on sensative expensive parts

:D

patton98 · Post by **patton98** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:07 pm

nice tip poster....

PosterGrampa · Post by **PosterGrampa** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 11:57 am

Just thought I'd pass along those e-test numbers before & after the cat & o2 senser changes
Before, After, Limit
HC ppm 115 36 72
CO% 0.17 0.03 0.40
NO ppm 331 27 550

As U can see there was a great improvement & I think the # are fantastic for a car that has over 200,000 Km(120,000 m US) on it. Now that everything is working right, it has some giddy up & go in it

BigMac · Post by **BigMac** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 1:31 am

GreeNeons03 wrote:I thought I read that the first gen Neons did the "turn key three times" thing aswell. Doesn't the CEL just flash a number of times to give the code?

I don't know about OBDI 1st gens, but for OBDII Neons here's the procedure:

Turn the ignition switch on-off-on-off-on within 5 seconds ("on" means the warning lights are on; do not crank the engine). Watch the CEL (check engine light). Count the number of flashes. Pauses between groups of flashes separate the first and second digits of the DTC (diagnostic trouble code). Longer pauses separate multiple DTCs. "5 flashes [pause] 5 flashes" (55) represents the end of the test.

For example: "flash-flash [pause] flash [long pause] flash-flash-flash [pause] flash-flash-flash [long pause] flash-flash-flash-flash-flash [pause] flash-flash-flash-flash- flash" represents DTCs 21 and 33, with 55 representing the end of the test.

Post by **occasional demons** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 7:20 am

BigMac wrote:
GreeNeons03 wrote:I thought I read that the first gen Neons did the "turn key three times" thing aswell. Doesn't the CEL just flash a number of times to give the code?
I don't know about OBDI 1st gens, but for OBDII Neons here's the procedure:

Turn the ignition switch on-off-on-off-on within 5 seconds ("on" means the warning lights are on; do not crank the engine). Watch the CEL (check engine light). Count the number of flashes. Pauses between groups of flashes separate the first and second digits of the DTC (diagnostic trouble code). Longer pauses separate multiple DTCs. "5 flashes [pause] 5 flashes" (55) represents the end of the test.

For example: "flash-flash [pause] flash [long pause] flash-flash-flash [pause] flash-flash-flash [long pause] flash-flash-flash-flash-flash [pause] flash-flash-flash-flash- flash" represents DTCs 21 and 33, with 55 representing the end of the test.

That should OBDI. OBDII displays the code right on the odometer. But like I mentioned, '97-'99 models may not do either.

BigMac · Post by **BigMac** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 4:16 am

Nope, you're wrong. My 99 blinks the CEL. I think you're thinking of how the 2nd gens work, because my SRT does use the odometer for codes.

Post by **occasional demons** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 5:22 am

Hmm, that's interesting, unless they pulled a fast one on EPA, all OBDII codes I have seen are 4 digit codes. You're lucky at least you can get the codes for it. Like I mentioned the jeeps don't give shit w/out a scan tool. And they are basically the same codes as the '01's in the FSM. Possibly they got away with older tech on the more efficient cars. Tho it didn't help. My XJ sucks gas like there's no tomorrow. No matter what I do, it compensates and still sucks. It is NGC's evil alter ego.
Edit: you wouldn't have any pics of the PCM would you?

BigMac · Post by **BigMac** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:44 am

Sorry, I should clarify: the blinking CEL displays a two-digit "hex code" that corresponds to the p#### DTC that you'd see with a scan tool. So it's just a display issue, not a difference in the OBD system itself.

No, sorry, I don't have a pic of the PCM.

Just for the record, all 96+ Neons are OBDII. I'm not sure about the 95s but I don't think they are.