The great 2gn suspension test

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:03 pm

Would anybody be interested in seeing a test including:
Dyno plots
General data
Track test

Of the major suspension setups you would put under a 2gn including:
The average stock strut overly lowered overly soft
BYRs ghetto handling pack
Mopar coilovers
BC coilovers
Megan Coilover
Eibach Coilover
Sleved Konis
Motons(If I can get somebody with an equiped car to participate)

The track test would either be at Pocono or Summit Point and any 2gn member is welcome to attend. This test will come at great expense to me (Over $8000 of suspension components plus track and equipment rental) however I am determined to finally have real data regarding the suspension systems we can use.

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:06 pm

that would be awesome todo!!!!

How do you plan on doing this?

Mat00ES · Post by **Mat00ES** » Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:08 pm

Can I have one of the coilover sets after the trial?

I'd be interested, not sure how far away it is, but it sounds like a good time.

Mopar65 · Post by **Mopar65** » Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:19 pm

I'm very interested, subscribed

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:26 pm

Gathering the info is a fairly easy part I should have a spreadsheet by the end of the week.
I will need to speak with a few vendors I hope to maybe be able to rent or otherwise get the parts at less than cost. If I wind up having to pay out of pocket yes the unused coils will be forsale.

I would like to put a complete novice in the car along with Mark and Myself and maybe if I pull the right strings I can get a pro drive to evaluate the car as well

Mopar65 · Post by **Mopar65** » Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:29 pm

bone-yard-racing wrote:Gathering the info is a fairly easy part I should have a spreadsheet by the end of the week.
I will need to speak with a few vendors I hope to maybe be able to rent or otherwise get the parts at less than cost. If I wind up having to pay out of pocket yes the unused coils will be forsale.

I would like to put a complete novice in the car along with Mark and Myself and maybe if I pull the right strings I can get a pro drive to evaluate the car as well

Let me know the full details when you get them along with dates and prices and all that. This sounds like the best road trip/suspension testing thingy ever

Mike

r/tguy02 · Post by **r/tguy02** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:22 am

blair whats the point in dyno plots in a suspension comparison test? BTW i think this is a great idea, if i had anything to contribute i would, but sadly i has no coilovers

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:52 am

Shock dyno

r/tguy02 · Post by **r/tguy02** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:54 am

ahh thanks for clarifying

superdan · Post by **superdan** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:56 am

i will do it if we are going through some twisties

btw i have megans

theTeejmiester · Post by **theTeejmiester** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:35 am

i would be very interested in the results of said tests.

Haganracing · Post by **Haganracing** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 8:47 am

Mat, dan.. Summit point is about 30-45mins from my house. You guys can crash here if you want

Donkeypuncher · Post by **Donkeypuncher** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:25 pm

Would this include dyno testing the struts?

If you were closer I'd let you use my h&r LE springs for your test since they're sitting in the garage and I'm too lazy to install them.

Props to your for doing this, it would be nice to have solid tests that put to rest any arguments about what setup is the best. Yeah that rhymed and I didn't intend it to.

heydockyle · Post by **heydockyle** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 9:21 pm

I no haz coilovers or I'd def come.

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 9:59 pm

As much as I like graphs and charts this would be a wasted exercise, and a huge waste of money. This test would tell us absolutely nothing new we don't already know. Not only that but unless you test all these setups on the same car the track data will be non-comparable. I love data, but to do a full comparison and proper test just isn't going to happen, if it does you're nuts and you're better off just sending me all the money you would waste.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:03 pm

fixitmattman wrote:As much as I like graphs and charts this would be a wasted exercise, and a huge waste of money. This test would tell us absolutely nothing new we don't already know. Not only that but unless you test all these setups on the same car the track data will be non-comparable. I love data, but to do a full comparison and proper test just isn't going to happen, if it does you're nuts and you're better off just sending me all the money you would waste.

Well said.

Post by **racer12306** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:04 pm

hansken_yo wrote:
fixitmattman wrote:As much as I like graphs and charts this would be a wasted exercise, and a huge waste of money. This test would tell us absolutely nothing new we don't already know. Not only that but unless you test all these setups on the same car the track data will be non-comparable. I love data, but to do a full comparison and proper test just isn't going to happen, if it does you're nuts and you're better off just sending me all the money you would waste.
Well said.

engineers love data and graphs and charts

fixitmattman · Post by **fixitmattman** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:07 pm

I made a graph of a hill at work, it rocked.

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:15 am

I was inviting people to observe not to use their cars. All the products will be tested on what could be looked at as an averagely modded 2gn(Intake, Exhaust, Bushings)

All the testing will be on the same track on the same day

I thought it was well accepted by now that I am in fact quite nuts

Im not doing this to quantify the opinon Ive been sharing forever or to prove one product is better than the other my only interest here is putting the best product on my car and to do that I need to compare if we as a group can learn something from it what is the big deal?

Mopar_Korean · Post by **Mopar_Korean** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:48 am

Way to go this is how to get stuff done and put to all the BS to rest. I wish you all the best and I eager to see the data.

But to help save money wouldn't it be easier to request dyno data from the different manufactures? Some of the higher end companies should have some sort of data from all their R&D.

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:54 am

In all reality Im dealing with 3 high end manufacturers (Koni, Moton, and, KW) its not all that hard once I have the attachment plates made its only 20 minutes or so to dyno each shock

I havent heard from any of the vendors Ive contacted so we may have to make some changes to the test

excon · Post by **excon** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 8:27 pm

i would say that you're slightly biased towards koni...

...so how would this be a fair test?

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 9:27 pm

Because all but one of the products Im testing are going on just as they come out of the box set at both the factory recomended damper and height settings.

If I decide to do a set of Konis the process to fit them in the stock housings as well as the spring perch location, overall length, and, spring rate will be clearly published.

In all honesty I would love the BCs or Megans to be faster than Motons or Konis because they are way way cheaper and my broke ass could afford to have super amazing dampers on everything from my car to my desk chair

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 9:59 pm

Here is the problem I have. Springs & Struts or Coilovers are just one aspect of the suspension system. On top of that this system has different setups for different styles of driving.

The overall setup is important, imho. I've had conversations about setups with the local SRT forum members and we have different theories about our setups. Some of that is experience as a driver (more track experience vs. regular) and then some of that is monetary means, which is also a significant aspect of how someone sets up their vehicle.

These are all figures that come into play and there are probably more. I would much rather see a comparison of how different components and setups work towards finding the ideal setup for different forms of events.

I found this very interesting and useful in how my car is setup now and how I would like to set it up in the future.

http://www.se-r.net/car_info/suspension ... 20Dynamics

I think this article only takes spring & strut combos into consideration and not coilovers...

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:12 pm

Yes overall set up is hugely important but not what I want to test here Im just after which coilover works best given a few other variables as possible.

In retrospect track times will be easily contaminated I may just go with a skid pad and slalom test.

I have planed a few other suspension tests that might be up your street.

I like that SEr article except where they guy complains about the acr, given his logic the SEr should be in SP right along with the acr

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Fri Nov 13, 2009 12:27 am

the only thing that really disappointed me about that article was that there was no discussion of coilovers, only spring/struts. I know that he pointed out the ricer drop, which tends to go mainly with spring and strut combos. I don't think you get the same issue with adjustable coilovers because you still get full range of the dampeners regardless of the height, but that is another discussion for another thread.