ideas on fixing alignment issues

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:45 pm

Had my car aligned at a proper shop since the last shop did a horrible job. This time this newer shop gave me a digital printout from their hunter alignment rack and showed me they had trouble adjusting somethings:

1. front left caster is off by 1.4degrees (reads 4.3 degrees and stock is 2.6)

2. rear left camber is stuck at -2.7 even with my camber plates in at full adjustment. (before the alignment it was -3.5)

3. rear right toe adjustment is stuck at -.52degrees. (said something was seized possibly the trailing arm or control arms. He was talking about some bolt that looks like a stop sign that was seized so i am guessing that would be the bot to the frame for the control arms.)

any ideas on where I should go from here? adjustable control arms? caster/camber plates up front? additional camber correcting bolts?

hybrid-Srt2001 · Post by **hybrid-Srt2001** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:51 pm

caster can't be adjusted on these cars without camber/caster plates. bc's are camber only. The stop sign thing is the toe adjustment on the rear control arms. its probably rusted up. i would get a set of dcr arms. As far as camber.... has the car been in an accident? it sounds like you have a bent rear spindle.

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:01 pm

just a 5mph rear-end, is the spindle the same as the hub? cuz I do have a spare hub sitting around.

hybrid-Srt2001 · Post by **hybrid-Srt2001** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:07 pm

no the part that the hub spins on. its part of the knuckle. Didnt you say you hit a curb a while back wrecking a rim....

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:18 pm

yeah but that is in the front and its not the side with the f'ed up caster the Right front was hit and there are no alignment problems on that corner. Figures right?

Looks like i can't buy just a spindle i can only get a new knuckle which is $187 new. Then again I should have a tech get under the car and really see whats wrong.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:05 am

ragek23 wrote: 1. front left caster is off by 1.4degrees (reads 4.3 degrees and stock is 2.6)

2. rear left camber is stuck at -2.7 even with my camber plates in at full adjustment. (before the alignment it was -3.5)

3. rear right toe adjustment is stuck at -.52degrees. (said something was seized possibly the trailing arm or control arms. He was talking about some bolt that looks like a stop sign that was seized so i am guessing that would be the bot to the frame for the control arms.)

1) Have you ever dropped the K-frame? If so and if it weren't put back correctly could lead to caster being off. Additionally bad bushings on the LCA could do this as well since it allows for play in the LCA.

2) You might be able to slot the strut to get more camber adjustment. In this case though you're needing to slot inward toward the strut casing instead of outward.

3) not real sure about this part, but seized parts are not good.

Now, IF you have $$$KaChing$$$ then I'd suggest a suspension overhaul.
- New bearings, bushings, getting Coilovers with camber adjustment (something like BCs) etc. etc.

neonslg09 · Post by **neonslg09** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:08 am

he has bc's yo man.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:20 am

Missed that...

Then I believe there is something wrong with the knuckle, spindle, hub, bearing mess

OB · Post by OB » Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:38 pm

Yeah, caster should not change unless there is noticeable slop in the suspension or if there is a bent component from an accident. The good thing is, caster isn't going to cause any tire wear issues. It will just cause a drift (or pull if it is bad enough) and might make the steering wheel stick rather than return on its own after a turn.

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:37 pm

thanks for the input guys

so here is the plan:

front suspension:
1. New Control arms or LCA prothane bushings.
if needed:
2. Ground Contol caster adjustable camber plates (expensive)

Rear suspension:
1. Mopar or DCR control arms
2. Mopar trailing arms
3. new nuckle

damn a lot of work ahead.

neonslg09 · Post by **neonslg09** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:42 pm

Research some things about the DCR arms. Some say they aren't good for DD'ing. Something about lubing the bushings or something like that. Crystal loves her Mopar Arms, but they are a little pricey.

Post by **occasional demons** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:25 pm

Also have the front strut towers spec'ed to be sure they are in the proper position. The question is: Is the caster out from the bottom, or the top? If the tower got torqued a bit from the hit, it could throw the caster off.

excon · Post by **excon** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 1:03 pm

could it be possible that you have frame damage?

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 2:09 pm

Did you also get the camber plates for the rear BC Coils? If not I would suggest that as well for more adjustability.

neonslg09 · Post by **neonslg09** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 2:12 pm

Yea he did. I remember him saying that he was upset because they now offer the BC's with rear camber plates.

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:49 am

the caster is off on the side of the car that was never hit but, I believe I am getting symptoms of bad LCAs. Which would cause the caster to be off.

I do currently have camber plates both front and rear. even with the plates there wasn't enough adjustability to get rid of the huge negative camber from the left rear. I was also told that there could be a posibility that the rear control arm could be slightly bent and could cause the added camber.

MyNeonSaysHi · Post by **MyNeonSaysHi** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:39 am

Caster generally changes when you lower the car. Don't worry about that. -3.5 rear camber, ouch!!!

Just take it to a different shop. I have been to numerous alignment shops and about half of them have no idea WTF they are doing and will feed you BS. (Around here anyways)

ragek23 · Post by **ragek23** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:44 am

I took it to this shop just cuz they have a lazer hunter system and they can give me a printout of where the car is at when they are done. However, they only do the alignment adjustments they don't do repair work since they are an alignment/tire shop.

OB · Post by OB » Sat Jan 02, 2010 8:04 pm

MyNeonSaysHi wrote:Caster generally changes when you lower the car. Don't worry about that. -3.5 rear camber, ouch!!!

Just take it to a different shop. I have been to numerous alignment shops and about half of them have no idea WTF they are doing and will feed you BS. (Around here anyways)

Caster shouldn't change no matter what you do. Very little if any when lowering. The strut tower and LCA are what secure the caster setting (built into the geometry from the factory). One or both of them would have to physically shift for a change in caster. The only way it might change from normal wear-and-tear is if the LCA bushings were severely worn/missing and the LCA mounting points shifted and/or the LCA mounting points in the sub-frame were worn out allowing movement. Obviously, a bent LCA or crunched strut tower/frame are much more likely causes of a caster change (common damage in even minor accidents).

Post by **occasional demons** » Sun Jan 03, 2010 8:57 pm

ragek23 wrote:I took it to this shop just cuz they have a lazer hunter system and they can give me a printout of where the car is at when they are done. However, they only do the alignment adjustments they don't do repair work since they are an alignment/tire shop.

They should be able to loosen the 4 bolts holding the sub frame, and tweak it, to come up with a compromise, provided the LCA bushings are all good. It may take a little hit and miss, but with the equipment attached, it would just be a matter of tapping it with a large hammer to get the specs where they need to be. I imagine the settings being displayed will change in real time. Anyone with the alignment machine should be able to do this. This would be considered part of an alignment. It is adjustable, just like tie rod ends.

It's not like they have to pull the chassis on a chassis machine...
Depending on how much it needs moved, the rear alignment may need readjusted to get it to track straight.

Any "mechanic" worth their weight should be able to think of that solution. It is not rocket science.
Sometimes you just need to prod them to use their abilities to their full potential.

2GN.ORG

ideas on fixing alignment issues

ideas on fixing alignment issues

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