help me make my car handle

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Sat Feb 20, 2010 7:45 pm

acr wrote:BC coilovers are the best for the neon... IMO

And you're completely fucking wrong again I pose the question how many Grand Am/Koni cup/World Challenge/Rolex cars run on BC products? 0. None. Zip. Nada. (I am unaware of how to be clearer on this)

Ive covered a million different ways and budgets as to how to make these cars handle Im really sick of trying as not one single person can get over this idea that coilovers are better. I will gladly put either of my cars up aginst a BC shod car and I will win

neonslg09 · Post by **neonslg09** » Sat Feb 20, 2010 11:00 pm

^Thank you for suggesting nothing but complaints in this thread.

Jerome Adams · Post by **Jerome Adams** » Sat Feb 20, 2010 11:29 pm

BYR,

I went back and found a few threads, and read your arguments.

My car is a DD that may see occasional auto-X...not so much to be competitive because I have mods that put me in way to high a class, but to have a place to drive hard, safely, without Johnny Law breaking up the party.

I have no desire to slam my car, but want a moderate drop to improve handling. I considered Tein H-techs on Tokcio blues, and several other basic coilovers (Tein basics, Eibach pro street, and the KW V1). The reason I went with the BC is because when you lower with the BC, you dont lower the spring perch, so you don't lose what precious little travel we have...

So with the BC, I can lower my car without losing travel, the spring rates balance the car out a little better (front to rear), I have camber plates in front, and I have some knobs to play with if I get bored, I will also have the tabs needed to mount a rear sway bar. They have decent reviews from several people and they are at the TOP of my budget....plus I already ordered them.

Now if you want to throw your $.02 in sway bars...that would be groovy. Stock SRT or Hotchkis. Leaning toward Hotchkis and if oversteer is too much, throwing on a front STB to try and take a little out.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:59 am

Well said yo.

Now I'm running Suspension Techniques pair sway bars and using Vibrant tower strut bars and my car runs pretty damn neutral leaning towards understeer. I've never had the inclination that the back end of my car would come around, but have felt it track around with me confidently.

FAC3L3SS · Post by **FAC3L3SS** » Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:12 am

^ Agreed some moar.

Coils are good. Maybe, as BYR said they aren't the absolute best, but who on here, aside from him and Mox, are really putting their car(s) through that sort of test and use? Most of us daily our cars, and for that any of the coils mentioned are perfect. Hell, mine greatly improved my handling, stance, etc... and they are even cheaper knockoffs than any of the ones listed. Could you smash me on a track Blair? I'm sure of it. Do I or anyone else care that there are better $4k suspension setups that would demolish ours? Nope. Coils are best bang for the buck, and the reason it's in huge agreement on here is because of the use of everyone's cars on here.

MoxHair · Post by **MoxHair** » Fri Feb 26, 2010 9:26 am

FAC3L3SS wrote:^ Agreed some moar.

Coils are good. Maybe, as BYR said they aren't the absolute best, but who on here, aside from him and Mox, are really putting their car(s) through that sort of test and use? Most of us daily our cars, and for that any of the coils mentioned are perfect. Hell, mine greatly improved my handling, stance, etc... and they are even cheaper knockoffs than any of the ones listed. Could you smash me on a track Blair? I'm sure of it. Do I or anyone else care that there are better $4k suspension setups that would demolish ours? Nope. Coils are best bang for the buck, and the reason it's in huge agreement on here is because of the use of everyone's cars on here.

Even I had the BC's on my MS3. Though, I had them professionally corner balanced.

Post by **Diablo0** » Fri Feb 26, 2010 9:55 am

hansken_yo brought it up and I'll second the motion in case any one suggest it... DO NOT buy the inverted setup. They don't last and if you're driving them on the street they will fail, it's only a matter of time. You may get 6 months out of them, you may get a year but once you get past 12 months you'll be paying out of your pocket to replace them since they can't be warrantied.

I speak from experience.

Personally, I have both setups. I have KW V1 on the black car and had BC Inverted on the standard 6k/4k springs on the white car. The BCs are nice for their being so adjustable with preload and height being independent. If I had to pick between the two for ride quality and performance I'd go with the KWs even if they aren't as adjustable.

Just this week I've switched to the non-Inverted BCs since my Inverted broke (see above) and in switching I also went with some stiffer springs since I felt the 6k (336lbs/in) and 4k (224lbs/in) were way too soft. I upped to 650/500 by suggestion of a friend and it feels much better. It is a lot stiffer so it doesn't make as well of a daily driver being tossed around but I don't mind it too much...

Jerome Adams · Post by **Jerome Adams** » Sat Feb 27, 2010 7:04 pm

I got the standard non-inverted and skipped the camber plates in the rear as well. They are still in a box in my living room (Fed Ex dropped them off yesterday). Might open them up later and have a look and then pack em back up til they are ready to go on.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Sat Feb 27, 2010 10:43 pm

Awesome

bone-yard-racing · Post by **bone-yard-racing** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:22 am

Forgive me for being harsh Ive been a bit stressed lately

As far as sway bars go I like either the 24/19 R/T combo or the 26/22 PT conv. Jc Whitney $80 bar combo. The SRT acr 26/19 is just too understeery for me might be good for some though.

You could go for a stiffer spring on each corner and use less bar the inverse is true as well (I like big bars and soft springs on street cars)

The big improvements are as Ive said before
Driver
Tires
Reduce Variables (Bushings, Motor mounts, Brakes, and, a good shifter)

Add a 22mm rear bar to that and you will have a very tossiable and fun car on the street all be it with a little more NVH

Just as a point the travel problem is really only with stock strut or sleve coilovers. Just about all of the coilovers you buy are an inch or 2 shorter than the stock strut lowering the car by that amount without taking any of the range of motion. The adjustible clevis is nothing new Ksports have them as do Motons (Anybody with KW/Mopars care to tell us)

NickKo · Post by **NickKo** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 9:05 am

I have read good things about the Progress 27mm front / 22mm rear combo.

viewtopic.php?p=714449#714449

Sounds very neutral, (maybe with a tad bit of understeer), which is exactly how I like to set up a street car.

- Nick

Jerome Adams · Post by **Jerome Adams** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:22 am

I initially planned on the progress combo until I stumbled across this:

http://www.srtforums.com/forums/f59/wha ... ng-415318/

Apparently the progress bars don't work with the BC Coilovers. I am going to look into the BYR's suggestions for sways.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 12:06 pm

Well, I've been running on the Suspension techniques with my BCs and they are about the same size as the progress sways... iirc 27 or 29 in the front and 22 or 24 in the rear. Very neutral with just a hint of understeer when really pushed.

Jerome Adams · Post by **Jerome Adams** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 4:50 pm

from modern...concerning suspension techniques:

Replace your sway bars and increase your neon's suspension performance. Comes with new bushings and bars. The front bar measures 24mm and the rear bar measures 21mm.

Please note, this comes with endlinks, and frame mounting bushings, but it does NOT COME with swaybar mounting brackets that mount to your strut. Therefore, if your Neon came with a rear swaybar, youll be fine. But if your car did NOT come with a rear swaybar, because Mopar doesnt make the swaybar brackets anymore, youll have to find a pair at a junkyard or buy them used off Neons.org.

SlvrACR · Post by **SlvrACR** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 5:10 pm

I had the full Energy kit, Mopar perf tension struts, Tokico ACR struts with Hotchkis springs, Hotchkis sway and Vibrant STBs and I loved every dime I put in it. Sure I liked the welfare sways but the Hotchkis rear just made it feel alot nicer.

hansken_yo · Post by **hansken_yo** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 5:15 pm

Jerome Adams wrote:from modern...concerning suspension techniques:

Replace your sway bars and increase your neon's suspension performance. Comes with new bushings and bars. The front bar measures 24mm and the rear bar measures 21mm.

Please note, this comes with endlinks, and frame mounting bushings, but it does NOT COME with swaybar mounting brackets that mount to your strut. Therefore, if your Neon came with a rear swaybar, youll be fine. But if your car did NOT come with a rear swaybar, because Mopar doesnt make the swaybar brackets anymore, youll have to find a pair at a junkyard or buy them used off Neons.org.

Thx for the head up on measurements... couldn't remember.

Jerome Adams · Post by **Jerome Adams** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 6:38 pm

SlvrACR wrote:I had the full Energy kit, Mopar perf tension struts, Tokico ACR struts with Hotchkis springs, Hotchkis sway and Vibrant STBs and I loved every dime I put in it. Sure I liked the welfare sways but the Hotchkis rear just made it feel alot nicer.

It is pretty much down to the welfare sways or teh Hotchkis for me, and I am about 80-90% sure it wil be Hotchkis....but it will be a bit b4 the bank account recovers from the coilovers.

Also found a NEON Auto-X and Rally-X junkie in my area (Jan Gerber)...shot him an email, so I am hoping he can help....A LOT!