Swapping dash wiring harness + skim

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:12 pm

I am currently doing the entire power options swap on my car.

My car is a 2000 highline base, no skim.

The harness is from a 2001 with skim.

I took the entire dash harness, rke module, chipped key with the matching skim module.

I have some issues right now.

1. One of the connectors for the blower motor is different. It is the two connectors that are on the right side of the dash if you have your dash pad off. The green connector is fine but the other one ( grey or black, i don't remember the color) doesn't match up. the connector is slightly different and the 2001 connector has 2 wires while the 2000 has multiple wires.

2. I tried starting the car while the dash was out. I only connected skim, rke, airbag module along with every connector on the mfs switch assembly. The car would start and stall, but it would do it more than 3 times and wouldn't lock me out. Would this still be a skim issue?? I mean I don't see how it could be, everything is matching and my pcm never saw skim before today..

3. I haven't checked the pinouts yet but, my rear body harness is from an 03, are there any major changes in equipment that would alter the rear body harness other than the removal of the individual door ajar switches. All of my latches and power equipment are from the same 03 car. I have checked the front door wiring harness and they do match up to the 01 harness.

Any help is greatly apreciated!!

Post by **occasional demons** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 9:42 pm

Yeah, the HVAC connector issue was addressed somewhere in the swap thread. I think they used the '01 up HVAC module.

But I don't think you should have connected the SKIM stuff. It might only be partially locking down the PCM. You may have to go to the dealer somehow, to get it flashed properly now.

Are you still retaining the '00 engine bay harness? Possibly there are some wires that do not match up between the dash/engine bay connector? IDK if RKE will work without SKIM, but I would unhook the SKIM and retry starting it. My R/T pcm is SKIM, but it starts/runs fine without the wiring, etc. I am prolly the luckiest bastid alive as far as that, or there is more to it, that I haven't figured out.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:34 am

I'll give it a try w/o the skim module hooked up.

Today, the harness and dash get reinstalled.

I was really hoping that everything would match up perfectly.

BTW, I checked alldata, all connections at the main hook up do match up, I looked up every pin out to make sure they were the same. ALthough, according to them the blower motor connectors are the same too...

Also, do you know what that other connector controls? I'm sure I can splice the two together somehow.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:35 pm

I tried it today without the skim module connected. And it didn't change. Today the car didn't start the fourth time.

It completely locked me out..

I do have another skim module that may have gotten switched with the one installed now, so I'm going to give that a try tomorrow.

I made an appoitment at the dealer for next wednesday..

Soo, while I wait for that date to roll around I'll install the rest of the parts like the rear body harness and the power trunk latch.

Everything seems to be working so far except the power locks. But I got close to a week to get that squared away

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 6:04 pm

Ok,

Today we finished wiring / putting the dash for the most part back together..

Of coure we lost one of the black plastic clips that helps support the steering column.. And you can't buy it seperately.. ugh.

We also started installing the rear body harness, now granted this part is from an 03 but the only pin that is different on the two body connectors for the rear harness is that the 03 harness has pin #17 empty and pin #18 occupied by a pink wire that controls the cargo lamp.

The 01 main body connector has pin #17 occupied by a dark blue/white wire, in which I have no idea what it does, maybe someone can help me out??

the car did not let me start it at all today. I thought that after awhile that you can retry to start the car??

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:25 am

If you had not pluged in the SKIM module then you would have been fine. As soon as your PCM saw the SKIM module, it then will always need the code. You have made your PCM a SKIM equiped PCM. Get it flashed with the SKIM # from the car that the module came from (you do have the VIN # of the donor car, yes?) and you should be good.

Post by **occasional demons** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:24 am

I haven't had a chance to get you the '01 connector info yet. I haven't forgotten. Last night was kinda busy.

I'll just have to search the connectors ex. C101 C102 C104 for that wire position/color combo.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 6:38 pm

Danteneon wrote:If you had not pluged in the SKIM module then you would have been fine. As soon as your PCM saw the SKIM module, it then will always need the code. You have made your PCM a SKIM equiped PCM. Get it flashed with the SKIM # from the car that the module came from (you do have the VIN # of the donor car, yes?) and you should be good.

I should have been thinking about that before I tried, but I thought that w/o the skim module, it wouldn't start either. Well there is no use whining about something that its in the past.

Unless the vin # is on the fuse box or any other part of the harness, than no, I don't and the car is no longer at the local pull a part..

I thought that the pcm didn't need to be reprgrammed if it has never seen skim...

I haven't had a chance to get you the '01 connector info yet. I haven't forgotten. Last night was kinda busy.

I'll just have to search the connectors ex. C101 C102 C104 for that wire position/color combo.

Thats fine.

I hooked up the two main wires that matched up and everything seems to be working fine with the hvac system.

Also according to alldata:

Connector c305 (which is the rear body harness plug)

on the 2003 harness pin 17 is empty and pin 18 is occupied by a pink wire that supposedly controls the cargo lamp.

And that the 2001 main body connector has pin 17 with a dark blue/white wire and with pin 18 empty.. Nut when I checked the two everything matched up and was in the correct pin outs..

Another thing I noticed about the 03 rear harness that differs from my original 00 is that for the group of wires that go the trunk then to the unbody of the car are different. my car only has wires for the license plate light while their was also wire for a fuel evap pump.. Does my 2000 even have a fuel evap pump? Extra wires were colored white/green and black (ground).

I have one other question.

My power locks do not work as well as the power trunk button.

Is this the workings of the rke module? Because I don't see any other reason why they wouldn't be working and the wiring diagrams say power locks next to all the wires associated with the switches.

Thanks, guys.

You have been alot of help.

I hope to make some type of write up for this when I'm done, to help other people out.

Post by **occasional demons** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:26 pm

OK, I have finally got the PC away from the woman....

F12 DB/WT is "Fused Ign. Switch Output (Run-Start) On the 2000/2001, from what I can tell, they are basically the same on page 8W-10-11 and 8W-11-11 in the '00 FSM. (Page 8W-11-7 and 8W-11-8 in the '01 FSM) Now, FUSE 11 G5 20DB/WT does power the SKIM, and RKE, but it is a direct spliced feed (S220 2000/'01 and S219 NGC), not through a connector.

Does my 2000 even have a fuel evap pump?

Position 17 C305 is for the LDP in both '00 and '01. 8W - 80 - 17 / 8W-11-11

You may need to rewire to get it to work with the '03 rear harness. Just need to figure out which connector they moved F12 DB/WT to, if not eliminated.
The NGC is as follows:

NATURAL VACUUM LEAK DETECTION ASSEMBLY (2.0L EXCEPT EXPORT/2.4L TURBO) - BLACK 3 WAY
CAV CIRCUIT FUNCTION
1 Z1 20BK GROUND
2 K107 20OR NVLD SWITCH SIGNAL
3 K106 20WT/DG NVLD SOLENOID CONTROL

You may need to use those wires and splice into the '00 front wires and use the '00 connector, to make the LDP work. Obviously, the controls aren't there for the NLVD system.

The LDP wires were:

2 DB/WT
3 WT/DG DETECTION PUMP SOLENOID CONTROL
4 YL DETECTION PUMP SWITCH SENSE

3 and 4 were through C105

The door lock wiring appears to be the same, but different splice numbers. S214 vs S226. whether this actually makes any difference, IDK. The '00 and '04 wiring are exactly the same for the lock solenoids.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:26 am

For the two groups of wires that went uner the car, they were cut from the 00 and spliced in above the boots.

I personally wasn't the person who spliced them, but everything for the group of wires that go by the rear seats were the same except an extra ground wire.

The group of wires for the rear is what had the leak detection pump wire, and its ground. I was asking because my 00 connectors don't even have that color combo on them.

I grabbed a pic of the only thing that really has numbers on it from the 01 donor car, its the inner fuse box..

IDK, if a vin can be made out from any of these numbers...

Post by **occasional demons** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 12:22 pm

What was the LDP wired to?

Sadly, the PN on that connector won't give you the VIN.

4794956AD WIRING INSTRUMENT PA $447.00

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 1:49 pm

occasional demons wrote:What was the LDP wired to?

Sadly, the PN on that connector won't give you the VIN.

4794956AD WIRING INSTRUMENT PA $447.00

That control wire isn't wired up because I have nothing to wire it to, nor do I have an extra wire any where..

I was just at the dealership and they said that even If I get the vin from the donor car with the skim that it might not even work. He said that I am pretty screwed because not everything matches (pcm does not match the other skim bits) He said If I can get him the vin from that car and my own he may be able to tell me how to make a jumper connection to start the car bypassing the skim module.

Of course all you get when you call pull a part is an automated line with no option of even talking to a live person..

Does anyone know for certain that If I get this vin from the donor car that I can have the skim code programmed into my pcm??

It is very important to have my car running asap, since I am really not home with my family an dthat I'm away at college.

Also As a plan B, can I grab a pcm from a car at the pull a part that is a 2000 and doesn't have skim and rke and plug it in my car?
Would it have to be flashed with my vin If I don't plug the skim module in at all?

I'm really kind of stressing over here and really regreting even messing with my car now..

Any sort of help will be greatly appreciated..

Thanks.

Post by **occasional demons** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:29 pm

Yes, if you can get a non SKIM pcm, it will work fine. No need to flash VIN.

An '01, or '02 will also work, but you will have no idle control. But as they get newer, the chances of having SKIM are greater.

But unless you can pop the column apart, or the keys are still there, there is no way other than running the VIN to know if it is SKIM.

I would think they could just assign your PCM a SKIM code to your VIN. It is just a 4 digit code?

But I couldn't really say for sure. BBR, or Dante will need to chime in there.

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:40 pm

The SKIM is indeed a 4 digit code.

The trouble is, once your PCM saw the SKIM module it was then asigned the SKIM code that is programed into the module. AFAIK, the only way to find out the SKIM code is through a dealer VIA DealerConnect. Even with the DRB the tech will not see the code. Once the tech has the SKIM code from the donor car, that # can be flashed into the PCM and you are golden.

Sorry if I missed this, but do you have the SKIM key that came from the donor? If not, all this work still won't let the car start without the SKIM "seeing" the original key.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:09 pm

I tried calling the local pull a part since by law they have to keep records of all the cars that they have had, to get the vin from the car. I do have the dates that the car was there and it was a silver 01. But.. of course its all automated.. So I'll be going there tomorrow and getting the vin and I might get another 2000 pcm to get my car running.

Yes dante, I do have the original key (even grabbed all the lock cylinders..)

The guy I talked to at the dealership (he was the service manager) didn't sound to certain that he can flash my pcm with the new skim code. He also is a little hesitant about me actually bringing my car there, he said that an issue like this happened before and everything needed to be replaced.

Post by **occasional demons** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 8:02 pm

From what I understood from Dante's post, is the SKIM module already assigned the code to the PCM. It is just a matter of obtaining the VIN, to get the code. Once you have the VIN/code from the donor car, you should be able to flash the donor VIN to your current PCM, and it should go.

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:11 am

Correct. While the daeler can do this for you, they don't often have people coming in asking for this work to be done. They are used to being the ones getting the parts and codes themselves. In their eyes, there is good possibility that you are giving them a problem to fix that they may not be able to.

Don't worry about them. As long as you have the correct donor VIN, it will work out fine.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Wed Feb 02, 2011 9:56 am

Alright.

If the snow ever lets up today I'll be going to pull a part to grab another pcm and try to get the vin from the donor car:

Dante do you have the ability to decode the vin and tell me all the options that were on the car?, Because there may have been a couple on the yard onn the dates I was there.

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Wed Feb 02, 2011 9:57 am

I wish I still did

BRR is the only dealer empolyee with that access anymore.

Post by **occasional demons** » Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:19 pm

If your local dealer has a decent service/parts guy, they could run the info for you. But getting a "friendly, helpful counter guy" anymore is rare.

I really miss the small family owned dealer that used to be near me. They were always willing to check stuff/discount parts.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:14 pm

occasional demons wrote:If your local dealer has a decent service/parts guy, they could run the info for you. But getting a "friendly, helpful counter guy" anymore is rare.

I really miss the small family owned dealer that used to be near me. They were always willing to check stuff/discount parts.

The service manager that I talked to seemed very willing to help me eventhough he was kinda hesitant about my problems.. He said that If I get the vin that he could possibly tell me a way to bypass the skim module to at least get the car to them. IDK why but he said he couldn't tell me unless I had the vin to see what it was equiped with.

Pull a part was closed.. so no running car this weekend...

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:44 am

According to BRR, putting another pcm that is non skim equiped in my car, will not change anything.

It will still start and stall with the skim unplugged.

And Even if I did get the pcm from the yard, its an atx pcm...

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:21 am

If you can find a PCM that is non SKIM, it will work as long as the SKIM module is removed before you plug the PCM in.

NickKo · Post by **NickKo** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:26 pm

Danteneon wrote:If you can find a PCM that is non SKIM, it will work as long as the SKIM module is removed before you plug the PCM in.

Meaning that, the SKIM has to be physically removed or unplugged, BEFORE the PCM is plugged in..... Right ??
That would make sense.

- Nick

Danteneon · Post by **Danteneon** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:40 pm

Correct.

srtgtr34 · Post by **srtgtr34** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:51 am

Just an update..

Car is running now that I got another 2000 mtx pcm..

But I have some weird issues:

Ac doesn't turn on nor does the rear defroster.

The radiator fans would not turn on by themselves. Relays and fuses were fine. I hade to hard wire it to run when the car runs so that I can drive the car.

After turning the key to off, the car will stay running for 5 seconds then will turn off normally..