Chirping near accessories even with belts removed.

srimes · Post by **srimes** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 7:30 pm

2004 sxt, 153k. PO said that a shop put on a new timing belt and water pump about 10k ago. I've put less that 1000 on it.

Chirps from the front of the engine since I got it. Accessory belts looked worn so I figured that was it. Put on an OBX UDP and filled motor mounts, noticed that the tensioner idler pully had a little play so I replaced it while I had it apart. Put it all back together with new belts of course, and it still makes noise. Just pulled off both belts and the noise is still there. Help? What should I look for?

Post by **occasional demons** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 7:37 pm

Possibly they did not replace the timing belt tensioner pulley.

Is the timing cover on correctly, as in not rubbing on the UDP? If they left some of the screws off it may have come out enough to rub. About all I can think that would be left with the belts removed.

srimes · Post by **srimes** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:43 pm

Well poop. That's what I was thinking too. Just hoping it could be something easy. I put the belts back on and the timing cover looked fine. It made the noise with the stock dampener and nothing looked bad when I pulled it off to put the udp on.

Anyone familier with the failure mode here? I usually can't hear the noise with the windows up. But it's quite noticeable with the windows down and idling at the drive through. Can I get away with it for a while as it gradually gets louder or is it likely to sieze up at any second?

I bought this as a commuter car and love the 34 mpg I got on the last tank (I get 18 in my Jeep). But I would love to put in a low mileage n/a 2.4. Extra pep and reliability for minimal cost. If it's the tensioner and I can put it off for a bit I have half a mind to say f-it and just do the swap.

Post by **occasional demons** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:55 pm

If the tensioner idler is the cause, it could either seize completely, or become very hard to turn, either way it will begin to take chunks out of the back of the timing belt.

Or the PO lied, and none of that was replaced. It is a risky roll of the dice. If you had said 2.4 sitting there waiting, maybe not so much. But it could still leave you somewhere you don't want to be.

In hind sight, you should have pulled the timing cover to take a look in there. With only 11,000 miles, it would be easy to tell if the water pump had been changed. It should still be relatively shiny yet.

I know I would have, but that's just me. I just have to see it for myself. It paid off on the daughter's 1gn. That stuff was supposed to changed too. Wonder how I know about chunks missing from the timing belt. It was replaced, but that was all. It only had 45,000 but had set for a few years.

srimes · Post by **srimes** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:05 am

I didn't even suspect the timing belt tensioner pully, or I would have looked while I was in there. I did look at the timing belt itself and it looked great. I poked it and there wasn't much tension on it: nothing like the accessory belts. But I have no reference for what the tension should be so I figured since it has cogs it doesn't need much. I suspected the acc. belts first and then the acc. idler pulley as it had play.

I don't want to dig back in there: upgrades are much more fun than repairs and the first time was a PITA. But the 2nd time is much easier and I'm no longer a virgin at getting in there, so a repair would be the more prudent path. I'm planning to move in the spring, and my Jeep doesn't have working a/c, so the ideal time for a motor swap would be late next fall/winter. But damnit, I do want a 2.4 and don't want to put money into the 2.0 unless it'll transfer over. Hmmmm..... decisions decisions.....

r/tguy02 · Post by **r/tguy02** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:47 am

the cost of a new tensioner is a drop in the hat compared to what you might be looking at in repairs if it fails completely. just replace the tensioner and be done with it till the swap.

srimes · Post by **srimes** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:10 pm

I finally dug in there and pulled the timing belt cover. It's rather dirty in there with quite a bit of what looks like rubber dust. I haven't pulled the belt yet but it looks fine.

The tensioner has a blue seal and looks clean. I don't know what the factory one looks like but my guess is that it has been replaced.

I ran the engine and tried to listen to where the noise was comming from with a short lenght of tube. It really sounds like the noise is comming from the crank snout, not the tensioner. Not sure where to go from here.

Donkeypuncher · Post by **Donkeypuncher** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:06 pm

Mine had the same tensioner when I did the timing belt, so that's doesn't guarantee it's been replaced. The oil pump is behind the crank snout but I'm not sure if it would make chirping noises.

Maybe you could try spraying some lube on the tensioner pulley while it's running and see if the noise stops.

r/tguy02 · Post by **r/tguy02** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:33 pm

the factory litens tensioner has a blue housing, and if you're finding hunks of rubber that cant be good...

srimes · Post by **srimes** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:59 pm

The PO said this belt is only 10k miles old:

by the crank pully:

Post by **occasional demons** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:57 pm

I would say the water pump is out of alignment, if that is the radiator side of the crank where it is rubbing. That would be the only thing on that side to pull it out of alignment.

The tensioner would affect the alternator side of the crank snout.

If it has been not properly aligned from installation, yeah the belt could look like that in 10,000 miles. If the WP surface was not cleaned very well, it could tilt the pulley enough.

r/tguy02 · Post by **r/tguy02** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:37 pm

Yeah the belt was def replaced at some point, but like OD said something's out of alignment. Wiggle the water pumP sprocket and see if it has play. Same with the tensioner pulley. I have a feeling one or both wasn't replaced

srimes · Post by **srimes** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 2:31 pm

I put on a new belt and it's much better now. I showed the old one to a buddy at work who is in maintenance and he said that belt was shot. I don't think it was ever changed.

Didn't bother with the tensioner or water pump as they seemed fine, and I want to do a n/a 2.4 swap soon.

I found an article about timing belts, failue type and wearpatterns:
http://www.industrialsupplyco.com/june-2010.html

If anything the wear pattern on my old belt would sugest it was overtensioned. I think it was just worn out after 153k miles.